5995 replies to this topic

[Favs]

Sad day

 

 

 

Cheer up Cliff, I fell down the stairs this morning - proper flying lesson - managed to move the radiator, crash into the porch door and give my left foot (Daniel Day-Lewis wot?), a good ol mangling too. Survival of the fattest Having comiserative/compensatory    delivered tomorrow  

[dablik]

I'm over it now Al, time to move on 

 

Cor blimey matey, wot happened ! was there a naked nymph at the bottom of the stairs    sounds like a good vorsprung you had if you moved the radiator Ouch, gear change foot, ya better get that up and rested if your touring soon eh......have you been manly and applied ice ?  gute besserung 

[Studley Ramrod]

Sad day

 

 

 

Cheer up Cliff, I fell down the stairs this morning - proper flying lesson - managed to move the radiator, crash into the porch door and give my left foot (Daniel Day-Lewis wot?), a good ol mangling too. Survival of the fattest Having comiserative/compensatory    delivered tomorrow

Kin hell mate, bet you're sore as f**k today. GWS buddy.

[Snowbird]

 

 

i'd try a fork seal saver afore pulling the forks apart as ya may be able to swipe out a tiny piece of dirt.  I prefer 15 weight fork oil.

Gotta admit I'd never heard of a seal saver, I recon I could fashoin a handy shaped thing from a plastic milk bottle for doing that so maybe give it a go.

The seals were done just before I bought the bike and I've only done a few thousand miles on it but I never got the hang of washing it so it's covered in flies which could well be the issue.

While the wheel is out it's only a quick job to fit and remove forks so why not.

 

Edit to add:

Well I made a little hook thingy out of the milk bottle and sure enough there was some crud come out, I took the forks (and wheels/tyres) into work and gave them a clean out in the wash tank and looked inside at the oil levels and they are pretty much the same so going to leave them and try it, I'll run the wheels and tyre up to the little bike place just up from work tomoz and get the tyres changed over.

Now is it really worth balancing tyres on a TDM or is that just for the proper quick stuff?

If the forks stay dry wickers I owe you a pint.

Edited by Snowbird, 13 March 2022 - 02:24 pm.

[fixitsan]

Also best oil from experiences for forks?

 

I'm still trialing a mixture. 30W in the left leg and transmission fluid in the right.

You can adjust the behaviour of each leg independently with the top adjusters, the 30W adds more rebound damping at any setting which I find beneficial. I've managed to adjust both legs to give a similar feel to the Ohlins at the back, because there's no unnecessary bouncing when  going on/off the front brake

Edited by fixitsan, 13 March 2022 - 05:26 pm.

[Favs]

Kin hell mate, bet you're sore as f**k today. GWS buddy.

Limped all the way to the boozer

[wicklamulla]

 

I'm still trialing a mixture. 30W in the left leg and transmission fluid in the right.

You can adjust the behaviour of each leg independently with the top adjusters, the 30W adds more rebound damping at any setting which I find beneficial. I've managed to adjust both legs to give a similar feel to the Ohlins at the back, because there's no unnecessary bouncing when  going on/off the front brake

 

 

why transmission fluid Chris?

[PeterGriffin]

Sold my TDM yesterday.......The grey one...still have the white one tho.....Thats another TDM on the roads in Wicklow....

[Studley Ramrod]

Limped all the way to the boozer

Good man !

[fixitsan]

 

 

why transmission fluid Chris?

 

It's an old favourite of bike shops from 'ye good old days' , Honda specified it as standard for their earlier forks.

 

It's produced to an exacting specification, so unlike 10W fork oil, which has a wide variety of viscosities depending on each manufacturer, ATF is more consistent.between batches. It's also seal friendly and resists foaming well. ATF usually has a viscosity of 34Cst, which is about the same as Silkolene 10W

 

I've used it in both fork legs but thought it was still too light for me,so I thought I would try one leg with a very heavy oil which has a viscosity (cSt) of about 70.

 

The extra viscosity in that one leg reduces front end rebound quite a lot. I notice it when coming off the brakes after heavy braking, with thinner oil the front end popped straight up, but with the heavier oil it feels more controlled. The adjuster valve is set to one click from the least resistance setting so it doesn't give too much compression damping. The leg with ATF mostly controls the compression damping with the help of the 30W leg. The fork leg with ATF is set to one click from firmest setting.

 

This might be a setup which works for me due to my heavy weight , 18 stone fully dressed, so it isn't necessarily a formula which works for everyone.

 

I thought i would try it after riding the KTM for a bit, where one leg controls rebound and the other controls compression.

If I mixed the oils then I wouldn't have the very heavy 30W providing good rebound resistance

 

 

 

Here's a list of some fork oils, you can see that between manufacturers, '5W' fork oil can have a range of viscosities, one manufacturers 5W can have the same viscosity as another manufacturers 10W. http://www.mediaturbo.com/clients/marzocchi/forkoilviscosity.html and here... http://www.dynojet.c...08/Fork-oil.pdf

 

 

Standard Dexron 3 ATF has a viscosity of 34.1 (Esso Dexron 3 is 37) , Mobil 1 ATF is 34.0 , I think 34 is in the target ranget for ATF, but older 'Type F' ATF has a cSt of 38.1

 

Honda standard 10W fork oil has a viscosity of 35 (Yam 10W = 33, Kawasaki 10W = 33)

 

Castrol 10W fork oil has a viscosity of 32

 

Elf Moto Fork Oil 10W has a viscosity of 47 !!!

 

With such a wide range of viscosities included as '10W' weight oil, who knows what viscosity they're running if they assume that '10W' means a standardised value, when it actually doesn't !

 

So sticking with ATF at 34 - 38 gives me a constant I can work with at least !

It's also very cheap (welcome to Yorkshire), 5L costs about £20

 

 

I've read pages of testimony from people using ATF still today, no problems are reported but it isn't considered the best when using cartridge forks for some reason, but our older damper design is appropriate for ATF

 

Obviously you can replace the ATF with a 10W or 15W fork oil if you were to try a split oil weight setup

Edited by fixitsan, 14 March 2022 - 10:12 am.

[wicklamulla]

 

It's an old favourite of bike shops from 'ye good old days' , Honda specified it as standard for their earlier forks.

 

It's produced to an exacting specification, so unlike 10W fork oil, which has a wide variety of viscosities depending on each manufacturer, ATF is more consistent.between batches. It's also seal friendly and resists foaming well. ATF usually has a viscosity of 34Cst, which is about the same as Silkolene 10W

 

I've used it in both fork legs but thought it was still too light for me,so I thought I would try one leg with a very heavy oil which has a viscosity (cSt) of about 70.

 

The extra viscosity in that one leg reduces front end rebound quite a lot. I notice it when coming off the brakes after heavy braking, with thinner oil the front end popped straight up, but with the heavier oil it feels more controlled. The adjuster valve is set to one click from the least resistance setting so it doesn't give too much compression damping. The leg with ATF mostly controls the compression damping with the help of the 30W leg. The fork leg with ATF is set to one click from firmest setting.

 

This might be a setup which works for me due to my heavy weight , 18 stone fully dressed, so it isn't necessarily a formula which works for everyone.

 

I thought i would try it after riding the KTM for a bit, where one leg controls rebound and the other controls compression.

If I mixed the oils then I wouldn't have the very heavy 30W providing good rebound resistance

 

 

 

Here's a list of some fork oils, you can see that between manufacturers, '5W' fork oil can have a range of viscosities, one manufacturers 5W can have the same viscosity as another manufacturers 10W. http://www.mediaturbo.com/clients/marzocchi/forkoilviscosity.html and here... http://www.dynojet.c...08/Fork-oil.pdf

 

 

Standard Dexron 3 ATF has a viscosity of 34.1 (Esso Dexron 3 is 37) , Mobil 1 ATF is 34.0 , I think 34 is in the target ranget for ATF, but older 'Type F' ATF has a cSt of 38.1

 

Honda standard 10W fork oil has a viscosity of 35

 

Castrol 10W fork oil has a viscosity of 15

 

Elf Moto Fork Oil 10W has a viscosity of 47 !!!

 

 

 

 

I've read pages of testimony from people using ATF still today, no problems are reported but it isn't considered the best when using cartridge forks for some reason, but our older damper design is appropriate for ATF

 

Obviously you can replace the ATF with a 10W or 15W fork oil if you were to try a split oil weight setup

 

 

interesting,  thanks

[Snowbird]

That's a good in-depth explanation Fixitsan, interesting to see the differences, as you say you would assume is 10W is all the same.

[leehenty]

Rode it 50 miles to the Super sausage café Pottersbury near Towcester. Breakfast there is a serious undertaking 😋
Then got home and polished the alloy front auxiliary light surrounds to a mirror finish in lathe. She's registered 20 years tomorrow. The old girl still goes well.

Edited by leehenty, 15 March 2022 - 02:27 pm.

[Snowbird]

20 years tomorrow, sounds like an excuse for cake Lee!

[leehenty]

Got cake already 😋

[trevini]

Actually managed to get out on mine for a ride. I've had it so long now it just feels like an old pair of slippers and that's a good thing in this case. Now to get the Guzzi back on the road. 

[leehenty]

I couldn't part with mine, had a few test rides on new bikes trying to "upgrade " but the main problem is, given the astronomical costs of them, the question becomes "what does the new bike give me that my niner doesn't?"
When considering this, the advantages are very few in actual fact.

[Studley Ramrod]

Hoping I'll get my old mk1 mot'd, taxed and insured soon, feel ready for a good pootle, weathers better and days are longer.

[Snowbird]

 "what does the new bike give me that my niner doesn't?"
When considering this, the advantages are very few in actual fact.

I guess it all depends on how many gadgets and gizmos you want to have despite the fact most will never use anyway, gimme a simple bike anyday, if I did lots of touring and masses of miles I may think otherwise but I don't so I'm happy to stick with a slightly tatty TDM.

[Favs]

Out for a ride today - fekin roasting with me LJs on - saw my old mate to book MOT for 23rd. Called for a tea amd was asked the leading Q "are you busy?", I am now.....