187 replies to this topic

[Kelpie]

I assume all these mods have to be declared to insurance companies to avoid nullification (is that even a word?) in the event of a claim? 

[fixitsan]

According to my insurance co every mod has to be, regardless or not of any performance changes.
And if nullification isn't a word then it should be.

I picked up a new word yesterday which describes my motorcycling 'peregrination' ☺ to go on a long particularly meandering journey......such as going out to buy milk and returning 5 hours and 300 miles later

[ProudViking]

You don't have to tell them everything I'm sure, Else you'd have to tell them about different brake pads, spark plugs and tyres, and we don't.

[Kelpie]

I don't believe brake pads etc under modifications as such.  I do know there have been several cases of insurance companies refusing to pay out when non-standard parts have been used.

[ProudViking]

Well its that dodgy time when insurance companies decide your "My other bike is still faster than you" sticker is a "modification"!

Ooh, Should I tell them I've lost five stones?, that really is a performance modification!

[Kelpie]

Bennets have some useful information.  It's peaked my interest so I will speak to my own insurer (Cornmarket formerly Adelaide).

 

http://www.bennetts....ons-to-declare/

[fixitsan]

You don't have to tell them everything I'm sure, Else you'd have to tell them about different brake pads, spark plugs and tyres, and we don't.

 

No, consumables are covered as service items.

 

But, the value of your bike, IE the amount which they will pay out after a theft, depends on what you tell them.

 

So if you don't tell them you have £500 Brembo calipers and a hand tooled leather touring seat which cost you £400, then they aren't obliged to pay you anything extra for those items. Likewise after an accident, a third party's insurer is not obliged to rebuild your bike to anything back to anything other than bog standard if their client knocks you off, so you could end up with standard calipers and a standard seat again.

 

I'm with Bennets, my insurance didn't go up after telling them I had a performance exhaust, and they asked me to differentiate between a full system or a slip-on can. It's not only about risk, but also so they can make sure that the level of cover which you are paying for can still cover the enhanced cost to replace the extra equipment, if they have to pay out to you.

 

Another reason is that added bling makes a bike more desirable and therefore more likely to be stolen. If two TDM's are parked side by side, one standard and the other has the nice touring seat and performance calipers, which one is going to bring the thief more money on the secondhand spares market ?

 

 

Obviously check your own policy, because if you have a policy which strictly enforces the rule that their compensation is based purely on the value of  'a standard bike' then you are accepting that you will cover any shortfall in value anyway and therefore telling them doesn't make a huge amount of sense. but if the policy says you should then it's probably in your interest that you do

Bennets have some useful information.  It's peaked my interest so I will speak to my own insurer (Cornmarket formerly Adelaide).

 

http://www.bennetts....ons-to-declare/

 

 

That is a great link....the list of accepted mods accepted as standard is useful I'm sure http://www.bennetts....s/#.VulpK0Aucmw

 

 

Although Bennets say they cover a changed seat as an accepted mod, just change the leather tooled seat above for an expensive Akrapovic exhaust system and it's the same argument

Edited by fixitsan, 16 March 2016 - 02:15 pm.

[JBX]

I don't know how it goes in UK, but in Europe everything that is a modification from the official registered characteristics may lead to an insurance company issue - and also when the modification is obvious, to problems with the police.

 

This includes tyre size, rear transmission ratio, lighting, frame modification (the fork drop may be checked after an accident), exhaust system, etc.

Obviously this does not include replacement parts like brake lines (except non DOT marked lines), brake pads, etc.

Electrical system is not included, as far as you have the minimum required by the law about lighting, indicators and the horn.

 

That said I'm not a layer nor an insurance expert !

Edited by JBX, 16 March 2016 - 04:50 pm.

[fixitsan]

I heard on another forum, a car forum, of someone in Germany being reported by a neighbour for working on his car in the street.....and then he got into trouble because he was fitting wheel spacers...... Apparently he was an anarchist for doing this

 

"Ordnung muss sein"

[Bjørge]

I heard on another forum, a car forum, of someone in Germany being reported by a neighbour for working on his car in the street.....and then he got into trouble because he was fitting wheel spacers...... Apparently he was an anarchist for doing this

 

"Ordnung muss sein"

 

I sure report to my insurance company every time I fit wheel spacers to my bike 

[fixitsan]

I sure report to my insurance company every time I fit wheel spacers to my bike 

Do they laugh ?

When i fitted a GSXR front wheel on my fj1100 it needed wheel spacers....so they take your word for it !

Edited by fixitsan, 17 March 2016 - 07:45 am.

[fixitsan]

It's been a few months since fitting the ex BMW alternator stator to my bike and I need to inspect it to see if there are signs of burning or anything else untoward.

 

Seeing as the crank position sensor lives in the same cover too, I've been doing some research to find if anyone has attempted to adjust the position of the sensor pickup coil, such that it advances the ignition timing ?

 

As we know, there was a time when all 4-star fuel was higher RON rating than we currently have and ignition timing has been retarded (generally speaking) to compensate. The lower the fuel quality, the further retarded the timing needs to be to prevent preignition (pinking)

 

The difference in optimum timing between using 98 RON (super unleaded)  and standard unleaded, 95 RON fuel is between 3 to 5 degrees. On a vehicle fitted with a knock sensor the ECU takes care of the timing by keeping it as advanced as possible without causing pinking and therefore performance on such vehicles changes quite noticeably as you change from one fuel to another

 

But on a vehicle without a knock sensor the static timing is fixed, and must accommodate all available fuel types, so it is generally set to be as retarded as it has to be for the lowest quality fuel.

 

I would hope there is a US market version, or else it means that all bikes are produced and set up to be able to run 91 RON fuel. The difference in ideal timing between 91 and 98 RON is between 8 - 10 degrees of advance !

 

I'm going to carry out a mod which I've done on a couple of bikes before, which is to widen the mounting holes of the pickup coils so that they're slotted and therefore the timing can be advanced. On bikes which I've done this, idle is often smoother, slow speed behaviour is more perky and perhaps there is a little bit of power to be gained at the top end.

 

Something else which tells me that there is scope for doing this safely is the fact that a lot of people mention how hot the exhaust downpipes get, which is an indication usually of very retarded timing being used.

 

I'll hopefully get this done in the next few days when inspecting the alternator stator and I'm interested to know if there will be a useful difference. Not there is much wrong with the standard bike, I have adapted to it pretty well, but if there is room for improvement then why not  ?

 

Here's an example of someone doing this to a ZX12 http://www.drpmds.pw...tion Timing.htm

 

 

A quick look on ebay for 'ignition advance ' produces lots of hits for timing rotors....  http://www.ebay.co.u...dvance&_sacat=0

 

....So 4 degrees seems to be a favoured amount

Edited by fixitsan, 23 March 2016 - 10:47 pm.

[arthurbikemad]

It's a common mod on XJR1300's, anything from 2-4Deg, they are readily available HERE I've run them on my XJR for a while, but my motor is gas flowed and has advanced cams etc, it ran too hot for my liking and the gains were not noticeable in my case. (timing plate not the same but example) I've never even bothered looking at the TDM, it's an interesting thread you have going and makes for good reading. 

Edited by arthurbikemad, 24 March 2016 - 08:29 am.

[fixitsan]

When i had my fj1100 Arthur it made the bike feel more responsive.

On fuel imjected bikes it probably also advances the injection timing. If anything it probably gives a bit of scope to add more fuel with Power Commander or similar.

I notice from my analyser traces that when under load injection starts before the inlet valve opens anyway. ( a compromise to keep costs down when using low pressure pump and low flow injector)

On high pressure diesel injection symptoms a simple tweak is to increase fuel pressure and hence the injection rate......that just givrs more fuel everywhere. ...and smoke.! If there was a wsy to tweak fuel pressure on the TDM (resistors around the pressure sensor ?) then the O2 sensor could keep afr sensible on cruise ( closed loop), but in open loop control under hard acceleration (when the O2 sensor is ignored ) more fuel would produce more power

Edited by fixitsan, 24 March 2016 - 09:22 am.

[fixitsan]

The crank position sensor mount got slotted tonight

 

 

 

Initial feeling is that the roll on at low revs is much smoother. Difficult to describe exactly, but i felt the roll on from closed throttle to part throttle was always a bit twitchy, but that is much smoother now. Running temperature seems unaffected. Mid range seems more lively and responsive. Top end, its difficult to say, there were a couple of moments when i opened her up fully and felt a reel surge, but then again the temperature is only about 3 Celsius, so that could be a factor

 

Long term testing required, then revert back to original and see if it is noticeably different again.

 

The diameter of the rotor is 115mm, so circumference is about 360mm. Therefore 1mm of movement = 1 degree of rotation.

 

The slots allow the pickup to be moved about 3.5mm. I reckon a bit more work could yield 5 degrees, before the sensor baseplate touches the rotor cover.

 

 

 

[arthurbikemad]

5deg would be nice, you should certainly feel it, as you said FJ and XJR defo pick up better with the advanced plate, my old XJR (HERE) runs hot anyway thanks to cam timing.. I'd like to play with the TDM ignition timing as you are see how it feels.

Edited by arthurbikemad, 25 March 2016 - 08:36 am.

[fixitsan]

I'm off work for over a week Arthur and intend making some long trips to nowhere in particular ☺ ....so i should have a better feel for it after that. If the weather forces me to stay at home I might attack it again and take it to the limit, fill with regular unleaded and check for pinking again.

For the record, the pickup is located above the rotor/flywheel and the rotor turns in the same direction as the rear wheel - I'm moving the sensor backwards relative to the bike in order to advance the timing.

Edited by fixitsan, 25 March 2016 - 11:15 am.

[celticbiker]

Ineresting.

As mine has raised compression, gas flow, reshaped cams, corillo rods and a PC I might try this why you have a definitive answer.

[fixitsan]

Ineresting.

As mine has raised compression, gas flow, reshaped cams, corillo rods and a PC I might try this why you have a definitive answer.

 

 

I guess you'll need to be more careful due to the performance mods, but I get the feeling that at the lower end in particular, there is a large scope  for advance, but at the top end advance is probably nearer the maximum limit.

[fixitsan]

As I pulled into my street on the bike I realised i was in too high a gear... I was in second gear at 1500rpm, so i thought I'ld give it a bit of gas and see what happens and it pulled quite cleanly , easily. It wouldn't have done that without complaining, prior to advancing the timing