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Actually, Electric Motorcycles May Be The Way To Go

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#1 Quartermaster

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 08:37 pm

I had the offer of a ride on a Zero SR ZF13 on Monday. I wasn't sure about clambering aboard a binfull of batteries with a wheel at either end. I thought it would weigh at least 500 kgs. I thought it would run out of juice after a few miles, I thought it would be a bit underwhelming like most "save the planet" concepts. A little to green.

 

Well brothers, I am here to tell you that I may have glimpsed the future of motorcycling.

 

It looks like a motorcycle, when you sit on it you feel immediately at home (well almost, where have the clutch and gear levers gone?). The weight was around the same as a 900, about 190 kgs but of course you don't have to add fuel. It was suggested that I select "Eco" mode to start off with, I thought  "Here we go, this is going to be so dull". But it wasn't. Not even in Eco mode. It pulled away with no effort, well it should do with 144 Nm of Torque from the off. I meandered through the housing estate where The Bromsgrove MCC club house is located and made my way down to the A38. It was weird, there was no noise other than the tyres and a muffled "wow wow wow wow" which turned out to be me being impressed and talking to myself. People on the pavement didn't glance around as I passed which I found uncomfortable and I think there needs to be something to warn of your approach. Speakers pumping out a noise of your choice (I'm thinking big block Chevy, or Concorde on re-heat or perhaps something left of field to please the Greens such as a sperm whale, a baby kitten or a cicada).

 

Having arrived at an empty stretch of the main road, I thumbed through the modes to "Sport" and gave the throttle a bit of a twist............................. Well I wasn't expecting the explosion of acceleration that followed, good thing I was holding on to the bars, really...... It piled on speed so quickly that I had to test the single ABS disc a bit harder than I'd anticipated as a traffic island loomed, but chassis, suspension and brakes are all a class act and I made it round without incident. To be honest I kept it in Sport mode after that and had a ball. When I got back to the club house after 10 minutes or so of fairly disgraceful behaviour I was grinning. The Zero was a really good motorcycle by any measurement - forget the power unit and saving the Earth, it was a terrific bit of kit. OK the price was astronomical, I think £12 - £14K but I could see why people would buy it if they lived in a city centre.

 

Range is claimed to be around 120 miles ridden normally i.e briskly and apparently if you were to ride full throttle (just over 100mph, down an autobahn of course) you would travel 70 miles on a charge. That's from Bromsgrove to Bristol. Full recharge time on a domestic plug is around 8 hours.

 

I would urge all of you, if you get the chance, to try one of these devices, it was the most impressive bike I've ridden this year.

 

 

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#2 dmmsta

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 08:58 pm

Looks like they've made an effort to keep it "bike" looking, and the ride report makes it sound pretty good ta boot.

 

Range would need to be a little more to consider as a commuter replacement, though I'm sure I could find somewhere to plug it in in the work carpark.


MY06 TDM 900 Blue over Silver 354906_45.png
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#3 daveRapide

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 09:22 pm

Electric bikes certainly sound like a lot of fun to ride, but, with a 100 mile range and an 8-hour recharge period, they seem to be only suitable at present for commuting, where the exact intended distance is known in advance. When I go for a run, it's usually for 150-200 miles at a time, and, if I want to go further, I can fill up with petrol again in a couple of minutes. When electric bikes can match this, I might be more interested.



#4 muddy

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 09:36 pm

£12k sounds a lot, but if someone were to sit down and total up comparative fuel and consumable bills, spares, servicing etc., it could well work out a reasonable buy. Maybe even a saving.

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#5 dmmsta

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 09:40 pm

My annual fuel bill is ~ £2400, so that saving makes the bike financial viable over 5yrs.

 

But that doesn't account for consumerables.

Not knowing the tech, do the batteries have to be replaced, and are they easier to replace (if needed) than an 850  :hide:


MY06 TDM 900 Blue over Silver 354906_45.png
-----
Fuel Pipes
Givi Top Box
Renthal 758's
Grip Puppies
MRA Bubble
Dip & Hi HIDs

To-Do:
LED DRLs
Loobman
Powercoat Wheels
Hand Guards

-----
MY04 TDM 900 Blue over Silver Parts Bin
MY02 TDM 900 Yellow over Black RIP
post-1-1150550733.gif...post-1-1150559830.gif...copilot_zpsgezqc0xz.jpg...hids.jpg...

#6 Sidarta

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 10:43 pm

Hi Quartermaster!

 

Thank you for presenting in the future.

A multitude of motorcyclists, wanted to be in place. Consider yourself privileged.
Battery adjustments and power supply to recharge, will be a matter of time.
Apparently; soon.

 

Cheers!


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#7 Studley Ramrod

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 08:09 am

Sidey, you godda get wanna these mate. :lol:

 

It's an impressive piece of kit by the sounds of it.  Just need the infastructure in place to make 'em truly useable.  They're coming on in leaps and bounds.

Great write up QM.  Thanks for sharing. :good:


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#8 ChrisG

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 08:31 am

Agree with dave that at the moment this is more about commuting than anything else, but the battery technology is leaping ahead all the time.  One of the arguments a lot of people have against electric cars as that the people who would get the most benefit are those living in cities, where they often don't have offroad parking to charge it, must less of an issue with an electric bike.

 

 

Do you know if you buy them outright or rent the battery?  I did some back of a fag packet calcs on a Nissan Leaf when replacing the wifes car a while back and the battery rental meant she needed to be doing over 8000 miles/year to make it cheaper than an equivalent sized petrol, which wasn't worth it for a second car.   A Tesla model S on the other hand...

 

 

ETA:  Just seen the optional "Power Tank" means they can fast charge, 95% charge in 2 hours, not convinced that's really worth it as when would you want to stop for 2 hours at a fast charge station?


Edited by ChrisG, 01 September 2016 - 08:35 am.

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#9 Studley Ramrod

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 11:14 am

Must be a mare if you run out of juice in deepest wherever, even the nice man from the AA wouldn't get you going again.  Prolly a 60+ mile tow to the nearest station and a day waiting to be topped up. :lol:


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#10 pete7

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 11:42 am

They certainly form a key part of the powered two wheel future.

 

 

Commuting certainly (emission free in city centres) must be a ,ajor market.

 

But also a key role is surely for off road "trail" bikes. This would help address walkers and farmers/residents complaints about noisy motor bikes in an unspoiled landscape.

 

Storage systems (battery cost)  still need addressing I believe. I thought super capacitors  were going to be the way forward - whatever they might be, but I am sure development will still continue, funded no doubt by oil companies with an eye to the future.

 

Best of luck to them all 

 

I have always enjoyed the technology on display at IoM in TT Zero events

 

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#11 TYREDNGRUMPEE

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 12:05 pm

Guess we're getting to that point where the internal combustion engine has been demonized so much, that any bullshit seems plausible.

 

I don't / will never, swallow it.

 

Riding leccy pushbikes was a fun experience, but so long as we continue to consume, we have to recognize that matter needs energy to be transformed and energy is derived from matter too. An extreme audit would show that this enviro bike stuff is ultimately bullshit longterm and the only ones to benefit short term are the controllers.

My bet is on that the next likely energy revolution will come when the nature of gravitation is understood and can be manipulated successfully. FKH (#fuckknowshow)



#12 Robodene

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 01:32 pm

Quietness - fine by me (many of us are too loud). 144 torque - just what I want (more useful in this crowded and restricted island). Clean air from my activity is good. Weight not so good. But range - no good for me. Battery life is a big issue for me (and does the world have enough metals for everyone?) Finally, do I want to live near one of the new power stations that would be needed?

Edited by Robodene, 01 September 2016 - 01:33 pm.

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#13 ChrisG

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 02:18 pm

190kg is the same a 900 dry, so fully fuelled it's the Zero's lighter. What's the weight distribution like though Quartermaster?  I assume they'd try and keep the batteries as low down as possible?

 

Aluminium Ion batteries are looking promising as a safer and cheaper alternative to Lithium Ion, and once they get the Metal-Air batteries sorted the weight should come a lot, and some variants such as silicon-air potentially being a massive cost reduction for a reduced voltage compared to a Lithium based battery.  I fully expect to see EV's get a lot more competitive over the next few years.


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2009 900 abs, 42k miles, Yamaha heated grips, double bubble screen, R&G crash bungs, scottoiler, Autocom, 1500 lumen LED spotlights.

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#14 muddy

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 02:49 pm

Guess we're getting to that point where the internal combustion engine has been demonized so much, that any bullshit seems plausible.

 

I don't / will never, swallow it.

 

Riding leccy pushbikes was a fun experience, but so long as we continue to consume, we have to recognize that matter needs energy to be transformed and energy is derived from matter too. An extreme audit would show that this enviro bike stuff is ultimately bullshit longterm and the only ones to benefit short term are the controllers.

My bet is on that the next likely energy revolution will come when the nature of gravitation is understood and can be manipulated successfully. FKH (#fuckknowshow)

Energy has to come from somewhere and for the most part electricity isn't green. And don't start on the global warming scamduggery. I'd happily buy an about town electric bike as long as it was simple and cheap. But for most of us the attraction is the various forms of the internal combustion engine. Me I'd like another 2 stroke before I kick the bucket. 


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#15 dapleb

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 03:26 pm

I stink its bloomin clever and admire the technology and some of the benefits .... But

I loike combustible enjuns. Oi loike tinkering with me boike at least as much as I enjoy riding it. Oi loike the noise and burning me leg on the exhaust at the beginning of the year!

Not fur me ta but very neato. I know someone who made their car lectrick and after much ridiculing from the big block v8,northstar, 3800SC crowd heads the quarter mile list. :-) watching the car is weird, especially when the tyres spin without any enjun noise.
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#16 jono49

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 05:03 pm

It's coming weather we like it or not! battery technology is the only thing holding this technology back, as quartermaster has experienced, and on paper 106 ftlb of torque is a bit more than my VFR1200's 96 ftlb and when I wind that up it's a case of hanging on, I listened to a programme on radio 4 a couple of day's ago and there's supposed a couple of breakthrough's in battery technology thats going to make the big difference to mileage on a single charge and also charge time!.......Bring it on I say, it wont be long before they will have such performance speed limiters will be factory fitted, then the back street boy's will be looking for a way round it :badgerrock:

 

Oh and a big thanks to Quartermaster for sharing his experience :good:


Edited by jono49, 01 September 2016 - 05:05 pm.

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#17 harvey krumpet

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 09:29 pm

Great post QM. Leccy vehicles have me fascinated. Their are a number of bikes available now, including a trail / supermoto, which by all accounts is hilarious. Charging and battery technology development is accelerating as is software. Like any new tech their will be casualties, the history of industrial develop from steam to present day is littered with explosions and fires until the gremlins are ironed out, so their is still a lot of scope for the nay sayers.

If memory serves, Zero approached Tesla industries in the hope of using their charging system but got nowhere, sadly.

Speaking of which, check this out, the Giga factory.

https://youtu.be/U-Szj2qIYX8

You can't knock Elon Musk for not thinking ahead!

 

Having said all that........ I'm hanging on to my 2t's!


Edited by harvey krumpet, 01 September 2016 - 09:31 pm.

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#18 ChrisG

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 07:12 am

Energy has to come from somewhere and for the most part electricity isn't green.

 

Yeah but a petrol engine is about 25-30% efficient while a gas/coal power station is 45-50%.  Dunno how much you lose in charging batteries, but modern electric motors are around 90% efficient.  Overall I believe it uses a lot less energy to power an electric vehicle than a petrol one, generates less CO and NOx and more importantly it moves the pollution out of the cities.

 

I believe it takes more energy to make the EV in the first place though, but a lot of that is the batteries and as said they're improving all the time.


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#19 Bjørge

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 07:26 am

I would urge all of you, if you get the chance, to try one of these devices, it was the most impressive bike I've ridden this year.

 

Yeah, really interested ! I think that the (my, at least) future in bikes is with lighter, electrical ones - not todays on-level-with-car-consuming ones (ref the MT09 - wouldn't consider one with that kind of thirst).


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#20 Gowza

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Posted 03 September 2016 - 06:52 pm

Interesting read QM. Good to read a real-life experience not a knee down, wheel up review like you'd find in the glossies. 

I'm intrigued by the new tech but it don't stir my soul like the smell of Castrol R / sound of a twin etc does. Would I want to have a go on one? For sure. Would I want one? For local stuff yeah but seeing as I forget to put my phone on charge overnight it's probably not for me yet. 

 

Dunno why the Zero TT is only the one lap, the TT started as a trial of machine endurance and that's effectively what this is. 

 

Ultimately once the range of these things becomes more realistic, it'll be the powers that be that'll decide their future, not us. Just as they've pretty much done with 2 strokes. Look at Norway, it has the highest EV ownership per capita as environmental tax breaks make it more economical to own a Tesla (other EV's are available...) than a combustion engine vehicle. True Bjorge? 


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