127 replies to this topic

[NZTDMGUY]

You know that 94% of all statistics are made up !

Apologies for the hijack, but Statistics made me remember seeing this on the ZRXOA




It seems the lack of pirates is the Real cause of Global Warming.

[Rallyist]

'course they're shite Ivan, that's why

1. They sell more than any other adventure bike
2. They've been around for 31 years now & are still going strong
3. Every other bike manufacturer is busting a gut trying to copy them

But if Uen and Chirley had been supplied there preferred bikes we would be knee deep in KTM's

[howie]

Watch long way round/down rush out an buy a GS then do 1000miles a year in a 100mile radius of home don't make sense!

[Manx1200]

Watch long way round/down rush out an buy a GS then do 1000miles a year in a 100mile radius of home don't make sense!

No more sense than buying an 1198 or R1 and then driving around B roads (or any road apart from a race track), same goes for Harley's away from long straight roads, or commuting on a tourer. Buy the bike you like, ride it how you like. It's still biking.
I had a Ducati for 13 years before I bought the TDM, and did more miles in the TDMs first year than the last 3 of the duke's.
So much easier on my shoulders & wrists.

Edited by Manx900, 03 November 2011 - 10:08 pm.

[howie]

Yep I agree with you, I have done more miles on my tdm in a year than any of my previous bikes. But there is a lot of my bike is better than your's and don't i look cool on this culture in biking! personally i dont give a shit what anybody think's about my choice of bike gear or me i'm too old to care!

[3vd]

My TDM has made me fall in love with biking all over again!

[RobC]

My TDM has made me fall in love with biking all over again!

funny, that's exactly how I feel since buying the mkII after losing interest in riding (bikes) over the last couple of years.

I was in J&S this after, they've got a GS in their second-hand stock - bit of a porker ain't it? At least visually. I guess it can't be as bad as it looks, I've followed bike cops on beemers through some pretty tight traffic and the sticky-out pots didn't seem to slow them down.

[Manx1200]

funny, that's exactly how I feel since buying the mkII after losing interest in riding (bikes) over the last couple of years.

I was in J&S this after, they've got a GS in their second-hand stock - bit of a porker ain't it? At least visually. I guess it can't be as bad as it looks, I've followed bike cops on beemers through some pretty tight traffic and the sticky-out pots didn't seem to slow them down.

Aye, I took an 1150gs out for a test ride before I bought the TDM, really liked it, but coming from the 750SS it felt bloody enormous (and only being 5' 7" bloody tall!). The R1150R is pretty much the same bike, but much lower seating position, not sure what it would be like on a long trip though. Back to the GS , I don't think the height is as much of a problem as it first seemed, as a lot of the weight is fairly low down (could be different with a full tank & luggage on though).

[ripper]

Just swopped fom Mk1 to GS1100 wish I'd done sooner I really did like TDM but GS alot more me

[Geordie Guy]

Just swopped from Mk1 to GS1100 wish I'd done sooner I really did like TDM but GS all to more me

Ripper- GS 1100's dont count and the fact you had a 850 TDM carries alot of sympathy with me.

You should have thought of a 900 TDM before the GS brand in my book, but you were obviously in shock after selling the TDM.

Dont worry about contradicting the GS brain washing program, you might not be assimilate as yet because of the older model you have, but think about changing before the branded curtain comes down for good.

Ivan

Edited by Geordie Guy, 05 November 2011 - 10:53 am.

[ripper]

Ripper- GS 1100's dont count and the fact you had a 850 TDM carries alot of sympathy with me.

You should have thought of a 900 TDM before the GS brand in my book, but you were obviously in shock after selling the TDM.

Dont worry about contradicting the GS brain washing program, you might not be assimilate as yet because of the older model you have, but think about changing before the branded curtain comes down for good.

Ivan

Ivan reason for GS1100 is simple really I don't do modern I like to tinker and although I would have gone for another MK1 the rest are just too pretty!! and god is this GS a BIG UGLY F****R just like me and supprise it do handle

[Rallyist]

Ivan reason for GS1100 is simple really I don't do modern I like to tinker and although I would have gone for another MK1 the rest are just too pretty!! and god is this GS a BIG UGLY F****R just like me and supprise it do handle

I think you forgot to add a word at the end of your post ...BADLY

[ChrisG]

Not had a go on the 1100 but I've had a test ride on both the 1150GS and 1200GS and enjoyed them both, the engine feels a bit odd to begin with but they feel like a bigger and slightly more powerful TDM to me. Had I continued with self employed work I may well have bought a 1200GS Adventure as a commuter (buying as a company bike means over a third off as no VAT or income tax), the 300 mile tank range being a big bonus there. While I admit the Ewan and Charlie wannabies do give the GS a slight image problem, surely not buying something because of it's image makes people just as much sheep as buying something because of it's image.

[sidestand]

GS owners aren't all sheep Ivan - most of them think things out very carefully before spending loads on a bike - here's a copy of a post from someone who's had a GS for years & is thinking of his next change -

"Tested the lot today!

I had to be sure I won't regret selling the GS a I have spent over £2k on extra's, all of which I would want to buy again if I went back to a GS.

My thoughts at the end of the day are, well confused!

Tenere

Hopping of my 2008GS the Yamaha seemed a shade lower (both seat heights are claimed to be 870mm in the higher position) but the bike feels a shade narrower between the legs making it easier to manage at junctions and less of a chore to mount.

Once rolling the bike feels as light as the GS, it has a load more low down grunt, and probably a shade more mid-range, the GS "feels" faster up top, but that may be more down to peakier delivery, the only comparison I did was pulling out of a junction and gunning both to a reference point and the result was they both hit about 80 from a standstill in the same distance, with the Yamaha feeling far less stressed by the whole experience.

The Yamaha has noticeably higher gearing (4k = 70 on GS and 80 on ST) and vibrates far less, so whereas the GS is feeling quite buzzy at 85, the Yamaha is dead smooth at 100, despite this higher gearing my instincts and (rather unscientific) roll-on timing (one-one-thoudand-two-one-thousand) had them very similar in the crucial 50-80 top gear roll on region.

The Yamaha engine is definately technically superior to that of the GS, I have no idea how they would compare on a strip / flat out on the motorway but I would be surprised if there was much in it, and my GS has de-cat headers and a accelerator module fitted.

The other key benefit is the Yamaha is much better at fuelling so will cleanly pull from under 2k in top and I suspect will be easier around town and driving out of alpine hairpins, even with the accelerator module the GS is not close to the Yamaha at low down manners.


Handling is very different story though, my GS benefits from top of the range Wilburs suspension and have been honed to just how I like 'em.

By comparison the Yamaha felt immensely slow to turn, so much so I stopped to jack up the pre-load a lot more which helped a fair bit.

Even so the Yamaha was still nowhere near as chuckable as the GS it still felt long and low and reluctant to turn and braking into turns dived noticeably more (but far less than you would expect for long travel forks)

It actually handled bumps pretty well, especially at the front, where I think the forks are better than the telever setup.

Unfortunately the roads were a mix of wet and damp with few completely dry corners so I never got to really get a feel for the Yamaha's handling, I reckon with time I may get used to it (or buy a shock with a ride height adjuster)

After the smoothness and grunt the most impressive thing on the Yamaha was the electronics, I have ridden BMW's with "traction control" and when it kcks in it feels like someone has turned your ignition off for a few seconds throwing you forward, before turning it back on again and sending you lurching backwards.

On the Yamaha you do not feel a thing, the light comes on but apart from that you have no idea it is even operating. To test it further I stopped in front of a patch of mud on a back lane, 1st gear and full throttle could not faze the system it just drove through the mud as if I had slowly ridden through it - pretty amazing, similarly the ABS is pretty unobtrusive compared the to GS system.

The one problem is it does seem to suffer from a rather terminal case of blandness and I fear despite being clinically good, ultimately it would just be boring.


Twin Cam GS

Next up I tried the latest GS, this felt familiar, but the twin cam engine is noticeably smoother, it has noticeably more low down power and will pull cleaner from a few hundred RPM lower - it is still nowhere near the Yamaha for grunt or smoothness though.

In the midrange it probably closer to the Yamaha than my '08 and up top almost certainly beats the Yamaha, I think it also beats the older motor at all RPM's but most noticeable is the extra bottom end and more free top end.

Gearing on the new GS is identical and by 90 it too is feeling a little buzzy compared to the Yamaha's lower revving dead smooth motor.

Handling is pretty much the same as my '08, the demo had ESA and although quite good and very convenient I would say the Wilburs on my bike rides bumps better and provides superior handling, the best way to describe the difference is it has the handling of the later bike in sport mode, with the comfort of it in Normal mode, it just operates on a wider range.

Also as I can tailor it more I have my bike a bit higher at the rear so mine steers noticeably quicker than the ESA in sport, with better feel and feedback. Either way though the GS in sport mode "feels" a lot more chuckable than the Yamaha.

This bike was the one that I would buy if starting from scratch and with cost not being an issue, it just makes me smile - as does my 2008, for all the flaws / character or whatever you want to call it the GS feels alove and involving.


Adventure

I also rode the GS Adventure, this bike surprised by not feeling huge or unwieldy, it definately rode bumps better than the stock GS (as good as my Wilburs setup) but it was at the expense of feel and turn rate, it was not horrible, but lost that lovely sporty feel the stadard GS has.

If I wanted to ride across deserts this would be the bike to do it on (assuming the FD would last the journey) but for my normal riding and touring to and around the Alps I would stick with a stock GS.



Not sure where this leaves me, the latest GS is not worth the £3k+ it would cost me to move from a (well sorted) 2008 model to a used 2010 model.

If I was a new buyer I would prefer the later engine, but would not pay a huge premium to get it, the new motor is just a bit better in every way - overall a good improvement, but not revolutionary.

Buying new the Yamaha is definately the best value, but possibly least fun, either way I a not in the market for a brand new bike right now.


I may however do the swap deal, or sell my GS privately and buy a Tenere as I think the only way I could decide if I would prefer the Yamaha is to own one for a while.

Still got the problem of if it turns out to be too bland I would be wishing I had kept my well sorted GS "


Well structured analysis I thought - and he never slagged anyone else bike off once .............unlike some on here


Looks like he's even going to give the Super Ten a try !! .............even without Charlie & Ewan getting one

[robelst]

The 900 TDM feels quicker than the BMW 1100/1150 ... and about on a par with the messy jerkiness of the fuel injection.

The 1200 BMW is quite a step up performance-wise though (a lot more than the extra 50cc would suggest) and thanks to 21st century fuel injection feels much smoother (less jerky) as well. Despite the balancer-shaft it does still vibrate a bit ("Brummvibrationen" as the Germans say) but it's not numbing your hands or limbs and at least you know you are on a proper two cylinder bike. A lovely compromise between being modern but still entertainingly characterful. It pushes you forward generously and more eagerly than the TDM in the low + lower part of the midrange (say 3.5 - 4k), but doesn't have the "turbine-like" acceleration that the TDM delivers from 4k onwards. I bet the short-stroke DOHC 5-valve TDM could safely run 1000 rpm further up than where the red-line starts now and reach a similar max power as the Beemer's 105 - 110 bhp ... not that I'd be terribly interested though

Comparing the TDM 900 and 1200 BMW boxer is difficult: They are too different, and both have their good and bad points. The 900 TDM feels like it has far less rotating mass than the Beemer which makes it more sporty and responsive; the Beemer has a better and more relaxed pull at lower revs, and not just because it has 300 cc extra. Ironically, it's the responsiveness of the TDM engine that also highlights its worst flaw: the jerky injection around the 3k, right there where you tend to be in heavy trafic and need to pay attention to other things than the throttle and gears. Curiously, it's quite good again at 2.5k and will sit and pull from there happily in the first 3 gears (in higher gears. it's much happier from 3.5k onwards - for obvious reasons). The BMW is less critical there, although I remember my 1100S and -RT not being half as smooth as that either.

I wonder what the double camshaft BMW boxer will be like and whether it will be a little more exciting and willing in higher revs. I am about to find out soon, we just ordered 2 new RTs for the blood-runner service, thank G*d we didn't go for the awful Pan European or characterless FLR 1300 instaed.

BTW Ducati: I did 70k on my Ducati ST4 (basically a 916 that looks like a 1980's Honda sports-tourer and is essentially a great combination of the best bits of those ). Believe it or not but the TDM engine is not that far off in terms of being happy to rev up - quite impressive if you realise that the TDM is always considered to be boring while Ducs are wild and exciting. OK, the Duc was way up in terms of handling, suspension and precision of its fuel injection system but despite good MPG was more expensive to run as well: regular belt changes, the irritatingly loud clutch didn't last very well, not to mention the £6600 depreciation in 3.5 years time - basically, I sold it to a friend for one hundred quid since no dealer was interested to part-exchange a 70k example of the least popular model Ducati ever made. I do miss the Duc but the TDM is less of a worry as a commuter and I still have my Buell to fill in the need for sheer fun and satisfaction.

[Geordie Guy]

GS owners aren't all sheep Ivan, and he never slagged anyone else bike off once .............unlike some on here

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend anybody or slag anyones bike off,

If I have upset anyone who owns a GS or even a BMW, I apologies ..........

May be BMW should hand out thicker skin with every bike, or for those who need them a pair of Balls.

Not that you need either or any other Contributor to this thread.

But I would suggest you ring the parts department and ask for the Chip to be taken off all your shoulders and for a sense of humour to be fitted.

Apparently this is a standard request.

Only joking !

Again sorry, the GS is a wonderful bike that has re-kindeld that adventure bike market and for some bikers who would not have thought about riding has been a lot of fun.

But for Fook sake its a bike ........ and not a very rider friendly one either ie.... on price, after-sales, accessories or cost of official maintenance. Dont mention its reputation for reliability.

Personally I think they are shite and I would not have one if it was given free with a box of cornflakes, and some ..... " Some" riders are brainless tossers, with more money than sense.

But that is my opinion, if you dont like it, you have a choice.

Cheers, Ivan

[Trotski]

Get up em Ivan, from my experience, GS riders, here in Aus especially, are the Volvo drivers of the Biking world

[Saga Lout]

I love debates about BMW's on this site as Ivan's comments are always such great entertainment

For what its worth, I've only ridden the 1150 GS, as it was owned by my old buddy who I used to tour Europe with, and it was okay. different to the 9er but I guess it's what you get used to. However, when ever we made fuel stops his bike always used 3 to 4 litres more approx every 160 to 180 miles and it burned oil at a fair rate too, where as the 9er never burns oil as we all know.

[Borderraider]

Personally I think they are shite and I would not have one if it was given free with a box of cornflakes,
Cheers, Ivan

The above comment highlights the problem associated with drinking 'Broon ale'

It kills the very few brain cells that Geordies have

[Geordie Guy]