102 replies to this topic

[ProudViking]

Is this the sort of thing that will be altered during a dyno test?

 

I'm having a dyno soon but am intrigued by this, If they won't touch it I might give it a go before hand!

[celticbiker]

Do you have /are you getting a power commander?
If not then they'll adjust visa the dash to get the best fueling and performance.
That said, because a power commander only modifies the original pulse signal you can still use the dash to make adjustments.

[dandywarhol]

I got told by my Dyno guy NOT to use the dash buttons after he set it up CB. 

[ProudViking]

Do you have /are you getting a power commander?
If not then they'll adjust visa the dash to get the best fueling and performance.
That said, because a power commander only modifies the original pulse signal you can still use the dash to make adjustments.

No power commander and waiting to see what the dyno chap suggests. Its just the basic dyno for now.

[celticbiker]

If I hadn't dandy it would have destroyed itself by now.
In partial throttle (one or two percent) the cylinders were way out of balance.
Just increased c1 by two then increased both by 7 made a big difference.
While dyno's are technically correct there nothing as organic as seat of the pants tuning.
I'm sure if anyone knows that it's you 👍😎
If you are anywhere near me I'd love you to call in and take the old girl for a ride, get your opinion of the changes.

[dandywarhol]

Did you physically balance the throttle bodies before altering the settings when you found out they ween't right CB? I'd like another go on ol' bluey again, now the arse end seems sorted. I still think Fournales assembled the original shock with the compression and rebound valves in arse about elbow..............

[celticbiker]

Nope.
It didn't feel like throttle balance, it felt like mismatched fuel delivery and over all it felt very raw and sharp like it was a little on the lean side.
Whatever the PC does it still gets its information from the ecu regarding injector timing and duration so whatever changes you make on the dash they will still be felt in the PC output.
My approach was to set the dash to cylinder control and alter it on the fly, not easy I'll grant you but effective.
I wouldn't say this approach is for everyone but forty years of experience have me a fair idea of where to start.
As I said dandy, any time you are in the area feel free to drop in.

Edited by celticbiker, 16 August 2015 - 09:23 pm.

[frits44]

People do this easy test,

 

Go test drive in every gear on 2000 rpm, if in 6 gear your engine can not do it or it is jerky

 

then your CO is too low, open the CO mode en go up in numbers or points by 5 or 10 on each cylinder

 

Do this until you can drive in 6 gear without jerkiness, go easy on the throttle 

 

The engine can do it, and I did it the same way my Co is c1 50 c2 50. And my Co in my exhaust is 4,75 %

 

My stock CO settings are  c1 14 and c2 14, just go up it will not harm your engine. ( most engines run much too lean in the CO )

 

The fuel consumption is better when your bike runs better, it is how you handle the throttle.

 

Remember almost every engine is different in the CO settings and models before 2007 are richer in the ECU,

 

Later models after 2007 are leaner in the ECU.

 

Do not be afraid of the big numbers, - 128 to + 128, go up in 5 or 10 each time too notice the difference.

 

For a good running engine in low rpm your CO must be from 3.5 %  to 6 % in your exhaust

 

Again, very simple test every body can do it.

 

You can always use a dyno but this you can do it yourself.

 

Greetings, Frits from Holland

[Hombre]

".. models before 2007 are richer in the ECU..."

You suggest decreasing the CO numbers?

[frits44]

".. models before 2007 are richer in the ECU..."

You suggest decreasing the CO numbers?

 Hello Hombre,

 

No, what I mean that I need  in my settings 50 on my bike it is a new model, and old model maybe 30.

 

You have too test it, but it is very easy to do.

 

Sorry for my English,

[Hombre]

OK, a newly acquired niner, 2004, 19000 km, factory standard. After deactivation of the airbox flap and the improvement from that, the CO settings were increased by 10 from the 18 the C1 & C2 were originally set to. The additional 10 was an improvement up to 3000. A further 10 was, I think, an improvement. Tickover dropped by 50ish rpm and was turned back up. Will run OK down to 1400. Not as good as my Mk1 that is good down to 1200. More work to do.

Edited by Hombre, 02 June 2016 - 04:06 pm.

[frits44]

OK, a newly acquired miner, 2004, 19000 km, factory standard. After deactivation of the airbox flap and the improvement from that, the CO settings were increased by 10 from the 18 the C1 & C2 were originally set to. The additional 10 was an improvement up to 3000. A further 5 either made no difference or was a small step back. Will run OK down to 1600. Not as good as my Mk1 that is good down to 1200. More work to do.

 

Good morning Hombre,

 

Just test drive without the cover of your air box, tape your air filter, you will notice a huge difference in low rpm.

 

Your engine needs more and better air flow. Look at the small inlet ( tank and cover air box) by the pictures fixitsan did make.

 

Just deactivation of the air flap is not enough. Do the cover air box modification.

 

My engine can do it so does your engine do it as well.

 

My engine runs smooth from 1200 rpm.

 

I am only trying to help.

 

Have a nice day,

 

Greetings, Frits from Holland

[Hombre]

Has anyone checked spark plug colour before and after this adjustment?

[fixitsan]

Has anyone checked spark plug colour before and after this adjustment?

Its unlikely to make much of an impact to spark plug colour....what we know is that CO adjustments are effective only below 3000rpm, and only at small (5-10)% throttle settings. The graph which I saw showed a curve produced at 5%throttle .... CO was high at 1200 rpm but fell to normal by 3000rpm. At 3000rpm and at wider throttle settings, the dash CO vvalues are ignored and the AFR is instead trimmed by use of the O2 sensor

I equate the CO setting to the idle mixture adjustment screw on carbs. Probably a few good reasons why the ecu cant trim such low fuel volume mixtures via the O2 sensor...temperature perhaps ?

Edited by fixitsan, 02 June 2016 - 10:06 am.

[frits44]

testing different CO settings again, I have 50/50 in CO settings

 

yesterday I tested different CO settings on my bike, started with 20/20 and went up by 10 on each cylinder.

With CO settings on 20/20 my bike becomes a little jumpy and jerky on the throttle again and the smoothness is gone.

I also tested my Co2 in my exhaust with CO 20/20, and the Co2 in my exhaust is less than 2%.

It is too lean with this settings.( stock settings on my bike c1 14 and c2 14 )

So I went up each time with 10 on each cylinder, and I noticed that the bike becomes smoother on the ride and you can handle 

the throttle much better in very low rpm.( below 3000 rpm )

It is not so jumpy anymore when your CO settings are higher.

I went al the way up too CO C1 50 and C2 50 like before, and I measured my Co2 in my exhaust again and it is now 4,75%.

This is a simple test everybody can do it.

I have half open exhaust without catalytic converters, with stock exhaust you can test it too like I did.

Not every bike is the same in the CO settings, so you have too test it yourself.

 

Everybody thanks for the help and info.

 

Greetings, Frits from Holland

[Pict]

 

 

Sorry for my English,

 

Good enough, thanks.   

[Davetee]

Has anyone fitted one of these?

EJK electronic fuel controller?

Any good

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Studley Ramrod]

You'll be better asking this question in the 'All about TDM' section Dave.

[zepedrorusso]

Mine came 14 and 16 after many tries 45 and 40 make it batter at low rpm .... The chain must be more tight than usual ... Iridium sparks and KN filter .... take out on ecu cables The #8 for the air box is necessary .... TDM is a beast in jail . I installed The BMW 800 gs front on it ... só now is better than a Big trail ... it looks like a tank. Faster than ever ....

[davmoon]

I am new to the TDM 900 and have just recently bought a 2012 (62) machine. I was recommended this site to help with my fuelling problems. I had already fitted a BoosterPlug which went someway towards sorting the low speed throttle snatch but it was still difficult to keep the bike smooth around 30 mph/ 3000 rpm. I did the air-box mod and noticed an immediate improvement. When I tried to richen the mixture, everything worked but it made no difference to the running of the engine! my base readings were C1 14 and C2 16. I only tried C1 and went up to 35 with no noticeable change in the engine note, I expected it to speed up initially then start to labour when it became too rich. As a result I didn't bother with C2. Just because I could, I increased both sides by 5! I have a Gunsons colourtune which I could use if anyone thinks it's worth it? Otherwise it looks like it would need a lot of money spent on a dyno run. I am unable to road test at the moment. I'm sure someone out there has some good advice for me. Is there anything else I can do to the air-box? So far, I have just removed the brown/black wire from the ecu connector.

 

Regards David