Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Back To Drawing Board Again


  • Please log in to reply
28 replies to this topic

#1 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 04 November 2018 - 01:40 pm

Hello, Carpedians.

As some of you might have seen, my journey of swapping the engine on mk1 has been succesfull... as the swap goes. Though looks like it was all for nought.
After 20 miles old problems came back. And I am lost again what to do.
A quick bit of history:
Had problems with the bike since I bought it, my mechanic (who I don't particularly trust now and he's out of business, ahem ahem, maybe for a reason) tried to find the problem, done a few things and eventually told me it was an engine problem. I believed him, as I don't have no experience, apart from lubing the chain and pumping the tires.
Swapped the engine, but same problems again, meaning either both engines have same issues (fairly unlikely, I think) or problem somewhere else.

Problems after the engine swap:

Running engine, let's say 3000-3500 rpm, it starts twitching, and it's quite bad, makes the whole bike twitch with me on top of it. Higher revs seem to be ok. Smokes a fair bit, I think it runs rich.

Engine cuts off on idle, though starts up again ok.

 

Problems before the engine swap:
All above, plus the spark plugs get covered in black stuff fairly soon and then it won't start until new plugs get fitted.

Fuel consumption seemed very high, but hard to tell exactly as I wasn't riding it very much. 

 

 

When I swapped the engine, I left the old carbs on. My only idea is smth wrong with carbs, which I have no idea what it could be. My mechanic said that the first thing he's done was to calibrate and clean the carbs, but after that very soon the problem appeared again. Maybe he didn't do anything and just took the money off me. 
Other things to mention is:
After replacing the engine, couldn't get the carbs fully back on the engine intakes, the rubbers seem to be too short, so it overlaps maybe just by 2mm, could this make the engine run rich? Can't remember how it was sitting when I was removing everything from the bike.
Also, when I pull out the choke, the engine runs the same, it doesn't seem to change anything, or very little, maybe this also could be the culprit? I've replaced the cable and when choke is pushed in, the plastic bit on carbs seem pushed in all they way though. 
 

 

I don't have the access to a garage anymore and keep my tdm on the street, so unless I find to temporary rent one, I'll have to get the bike to a mechanic (different this time), but before I go there, I really want all your ideas and opinions about what would be good things to check next. I'd kindly ask you to be as thorough with your replies as possible, as I still don't understand so many things about bikes.

Many thanks to you all and I look forward to your ideas!



#2 Apache

Apache

    Knight of Postsalot

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 553 posts
  • Location:North Cheshire
  • TDM model: 1997

Posted 04 November 2018 - 01:49 pm

Choke linkage stuck / emulsion tubes
Where are you ?

Edited by Apache, 04 November 2018 - 01:46 pm.


#3 fixitsan

fixitsan

    Carpe Citizen

  • Supporting Member(thanks)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,667 posts
  • Location:West Lothian
  • TDM model: 2003

Posted 04 November 2018 - 02:29 pm

Choke linkage stuck / emulsion tubes
Where are you ?

 

+1 if the choke does nothing (and you have all the symptoms of rich running) then you should investigate the choke meshanism. Make sure it is moving at the carb end when you move the choke knob, and the choke isn't jammed on it the carbs


900 with better bits. Owes me nothing, Makes me smile


#4 James

James

    Knight of Postsalot

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 570 posts
  • Location:Cumbria
  • TDM model: 2004

Posted 04 November 2018 - 04:05 pm

+2

Choke mechanism and/or emulsion tubes - TDMs are noted for it, particularly emulsion tubes. The good news is that it should be an easy fix if it’s either of those.

As Apache said, where are you? Perhaps there’s a Capedian nearby who could lend a hand.

84 Honda XL600R  :)

04 TDM900  :good:

21 KTM 790 Adventure  ;)


#5 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 04 November 2018 - 05:33 pm

+2

Choke mechanism and/or emulsion tubes - TDMs are noted for it, particularly emulsion tubes. The good news is that it should be an easy fix if it’s either of those.

As Apache said, where are you? Perhaps there’s a Capedian nearby who could lend a hand.

Emulsion tubes been checked, apparently by my mechanic, but prob best to check again, if he's full of shaite. Shame, such a lovely guy to talk to and showed all the signs of being a trustworthy person. 

 

 

 

 

+1 if the choke does nothing (and you have all the symptoms of rich running) then you should investigate the choke meshanism. Make sure it is moving at the carb end when you move the choke knob, and the choke isn't jammed on it the carbs

 

 

The plastic thing at the end of choke cable was moving ok, but I have not opened the carbs to see what's inside. maybe something wrong in interior? from outside it looked ok.

I am in Brighton, Sussex. Would be great to get to know anyone who has tdm and lives locally. Funny that we talk about this as I saw one just like mine parked, red mk1, with aftermarket seat and top box and red rims. Unfortunately didn't have a pen and paper to leave a note. Maybe the person is known here?



#6 Apache

Apache

    Knight of Postsalot

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 553 posts
  • Location:North Cheshire
  • TDM model: 1997

Posted 04 November 2018 - 06:22 pm

I'm 300 miles away,Jim's 400 and fixitsan is 500.
Don't overlook the obvious. If the choke slide is sticky it could have been partly on when you installed the cable clamp. Release the clamp,push the slide fully home and retighten the clamp. Mine never need choke any weather but from memory you need around 30mm travel at the bars end. Rag left in the airbox ? Emulsion wear isn't easily visible. Very slightly oval equals heavy wear. Wear is inspected at the top not in the float chamber so they have to come out to inspect properly.....poor carb installation would cause weak rather than rich running....best of luck with it..

#7 harvey krumpet

harvey krumpet

    has been here 4ever

  • Supporting Member(thanks)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,049 posts
  • Location:New Zealand
  • TDM model: 1997

Posted 04 November 2018 - 06:32 pm

May I suggest, if a spanner wise carpedian is willing to assist, that you pull the carbs off and post them for inspection? Sounds bloody frustrating, put in a new motor to achieve nothing.

 

Just a thought.

 

It does sound like the choke.. 


TDM 850 Loud and unusual. CRM 250r Woo hoo! DT 230 Lanza Fiddled with.... Bloody hell, is that legal? GG Randonee AKA "I didn't think that was possible".


#8 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 04 November 2018 - 06:46 pm

I'm 300 miles away,Jim's 400 and fixitsan is 500.
Don't overlook the obvious. If the choke slide is sticky it could have been partly on when you installed the cable clamp. Release the clamp,push the slide fully home and retighten the clamp. Mine never need choke any weather but from memory you need around 30mm travel at the bars end. Rag left in the airbox ? Emulsion wear isn't easily visible. Very slightly oval equals heavy wear. Wear is inspected at the top not in the float chamber so they have to come out to inspect properly.....poor carb installation would cause weak rather than rich running....best of luck with it..

 

I made sure the choke slide is all the way in when I've put a new cable in, I know that for a fact, so from exterior of carbs all looked well, if there's a problem, then it must be deeper somewhere where I have no knowledge. 

Air box is fine, took it apart, put new filter, all good there. 

 

Emulsion tubes might be, but that will have to be left to professional. As mentioned, have no more access to a garage, doing all these jobs on the side of road in this unpredictable weather is asking for trouble. Plus I'm very slow with mechanical work.. 
Very good to hear ideas as I will want to discuss in detail with a mechanic. 


May I suggest, if a spanner wise carpedian is willing to assist, that you pull the carbs off and post them for inspection? Sounds bloody frustrating, put in a new motor to achieve nothing.

 

Just a thought.

 

It does sound like the choke.. 

 

I guess I'll be taking to another local mechanic, business been there for years, spoke to a few local bikers, they recommend it, so I hope this does not fool around. Otherwise, would be difficult for me to do such work as taking things apart on the road... I guess at this point I got no choice but to trust someone to tinker with my bike



#9 James

James

    Knight of Postsalot

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 570 posts
  • Location:Cumbria
  • TDM model: 2004

Posted 04 November 2018 - 11:53 pm

Well, if you’re going to get a pro to look at them, just tell him to replace the emulsion tubes as a matter of course. They’re not expensive.

But if you’re okay taking the carbs off yourself, and you have a Haynes, then the diy route really is doable - take ‘em inside, then you’re not working on the street.

84 Honda XL600R  :)

04 TDM900  :good:

21 KTM 790 Adventure  ;)


#10 Studley Ramrod

Studley Ramrod

    Monkey Boys Monkey

  • Root Admin(A)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 19,202 posts
  • Location:HELLO ! I'm in the Library...Notts
  • TDM model: 1993

Posted 05 November 2018 - 03:15 pm

Send me the carbs and I'll give 'em a good look over.  If it needs any parts I'll let you know the cost.


Mk2a 2000 in Silver. Top end Refurb @ 41100 miles, Scottoiler, Renthal Road High Bars, Up & Back Bar Risers, Bellypan, DL650 Handguards, Capt. Picard Bar Ends, House of Henty SS Wheel spacers, New Seat Cover Fitted. 58 MPG !!  Now owned by chrisbee !   Studley's mk2a Bloggerydoodaah !  Photos of my first MK1  Photos of my MK2a  TPLQHCSRSFC No. 1 Fan


#11 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 28 November 2018 - 11:04 am

Well, if you’re going to get a pro to look at them, just tell him to replace the emulsion tubes as a matter of course. They’re not expensive.

But if you’re okay taking the carbs off yourself, and you have a Haynes, then the diy route really is doable - take ‘em inside, then you’re not working on the street.


Sorry fellas, been on holiday to vent my head, no signal or WiFi. Yes, my bike now is with mechanic, I've asked to replace the emulsion tubes. Anyday should receive a call from them with news a what they have found.

Send me the carbs and I'll give 'em a good look over.  If it needs any parts I'll let you know the cost.


I'm very grateful for such a nice offer, my dear sir! Although the bike is with mechanic now, it's way too rainy and windy for me to take it apart without a garage.

I'm actually very surprised how nice and helpful people are here, lovely to witness! Mayhaps the works is not so bad as sometimes seems..

#12 dapleb

dapleb

    Monkey Boy

  • Root Admin(A)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 18,104 posts
  • Location:The home of morris dancin
  • TDM model: 1990

Posted 28 November 2018 - 11:29 am

Oid a sent them carbs to studders for sure over any other option but flingers crossed they get it sorted.
"Whats up", "Piston Broke", "Yeah me too...hic"

If you want to mark your location on the Carpe map: http://www.carpe-tdm...opic.php?t=5117

Doin valve clearances? Use dappers valve shim exchange program and the job will be carroty - Free (other than you postin me yer shims) for sporting members.

Active member of TPLQHCSRSFC and TSRMCMAS (even though a year off) and avid fan of PM not sent.

#13 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 05 December 2018 - 11:11 am

Oid a sent them carbs to studders for sure over any other option but flingers crossed they get it sorted.


From now on I'll have it it mind. I just didn't have place to take the bike apart.
Dammit, this forum is amazing.

#14 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 18 January 2019 - 05:48 pm

Hello again.

So back from holiday, took my bike from mechanics, which have pretty much rebuilt the carbs, rode nicely for 5 miles. Two days later started a bike, rode for 2 miles and all the old problems came back, can't even start it now. Talked to the mechanic, he's taking the bike back to have a look, but I'm on the very edge of giving up. Can't justify any more money being spent on this unlucky bike. The last ideas are fuel pump or electrics.

Any of you that have followed my progress and kindly helped got any more ideas what could the problem be?
It's not an engine, not the carbs. Seems like only starts playing up when engine gets warm.

Thinking of putting on eBay for spares or repairs to be honest.

#15 Studley Ramrod

Studley Ramrod

    Monkey Boys Monkey

  • Root Admin(A)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 19,202 posts
  • Location:HELLO ! I'm in the Library...Notts
  • TDM model: 1993

Posted 19 January 2019 - 09:39 am

The HT coil can show a fault when it's warmed up, but not show a fault when it's tested with a multimeter. It would also show itself with a sooty/wet plug.


Mk2a 2000 in Silver. Top end Refurb @ 41100 miles, Scottoiler, Renthal Road High Bars, Up & Back Bar Risers, Bellypan, DL650 Handguards, Capt. Picard Bar Ends, House of Henty SS Wheel spacers, New Seat Cover Fitted. 58 MPG !!  Now owned by chrisbee !   Studley's mk2a Bloggerydoodaah !  Photos of my first MK1  Photos of my MK2a  TPLQHCSRSFC No. 1 Fan


#16 dablik

dablik

    Master Intermediate Fettlin' Award 2018

  • Supporting Member(thanks)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,735 posts
  • Location:Bootleshire
  • TDM model: 1992

Posted 19 January 2019 - 10:49 am

That's frustrating, believe me i know, as Studley suggests me thinks ? no point giving up now as you've already invested enough, i think your nearly their Pj.


Bigred mk1 R1 Calipers- Braided lines- Givi wing rack-Crash bungs- Hi vis bullets-PR2's- and a hoot to ride.

Quad 900 Silver Laser duo tech pipes-Scott oiler-Engine crash bars- Radiator mounted see me ring LED's-Datatool system 3 alarm -Centre stand- Extender fender-Renthal bars-Handle bar risers-Mirror extenders-BMW GS Handgaurds-Acumen uprated horn & Nautilus-Stainless steel Radiator guard-Givi wing rack-OEM screen-Yammy touring screen-MRA Vario-MRA Double bubble cut down for fast as fk riding-Tiger screen-Tank protector-Stomp grip panels-Optimate lead   Gone to Heaven  :sorry: 

 

1991 MK1 in need of some TLC watch this space   :) Sorted and on the Road Mick  :P  :P it's the bike that Jack built  ;) Gone to Heaven  :wub: 

 


#17 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 19 January 2019 - 11:55 am

I hope I'm not far.. just keep asking myself when is it good to be stubborn and when it's good to let things go when it doesn't work.
Anyhow, so in case of ht coil (that's ignition coil, right?) being a culprit and it wouldn't show using a multimeter, best approach would be to replace it, right?

#18 Studley Ramrod

Studley Ramrod

    Monkey Boys Monkey

  • Root Admin(A)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 19,202 posts
  • Location:HELLO ! I'm in the Library...Notts
  • TDM model: 1993

Posted 19 January 2019 - 04:49 pm

Well, it's the only way of eliminating/fixing it really.


Mk2a 2000 in Silver. Top end Refurb @ 41100 miles, Scottoiler, Renthal Road High Bars, Up & Back Bar Risers, Bellypan, DL650 Handguards, Capt. Picard Bar Ends, House of Henty SS Wheel spacers, New Seat Cover Fitted. 58 MPG !!  Now owned by chrisbee !   Studley's mk2a Bloggerydoodaah !  Photos of my first MK1  Photos of my MK2a  TPLQHCSRSFC No. 1 Fan


#19 Pjkr44

Pjkr44

    really likes Carpe

  • Member
  • 91 posts
  • TDM model: none yet

Posted 19 March 2019 - 07:29 pm

Hi again, I'm coming back to continue my cursed tdm fixings...
So, still running rich. Replaced fuel pump, found the choke plunge was melted - thought that must be it - but no. Runs a bit better but still too rich.
Mechanic said he's going to bend the carb floats to make a leaner mixture - that's the last thing he can think of as all else has been done. A body mystery.
Can anyone help me to understand what's the bending of floats and is there any negative side to doing so?
Thank you

#20 dablik

dablik

    Master Intermediate Fettlin' Award 2018

  • Supporting Member(thanks)
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,735 posts
  • Location:Bootleshire
  • TDM model: 1992

Posted 19 March 2019 - 08:39 pm

Bending of floats will adjust the height the floats float, quite normal but a delicate operation, no negative side to it and he's doing it so less fuel (or more if needed) is in the float bowl which then gets burnt.


Bigred mk1 R1 Calipers- Braided lines- Givi wing rack-Crash bungs- Hi vis bullets-PR2's- and a hoot to ride.

Quad 900 Silver Laser duo tech pipes-Scott oiler-Engine crash bars- Radiator mounted see me ring LED's-Datatool system 3 alarm -Centre stand- Extender fender-Renthal bars-Handle bar risers-Mirror extenders-BMW GS Handgaurds-Acumen uprated horn & Nautilus-Stainless steel Radiator guard-Givi wing rack-OEM screen-Yammy touring screen-MRA Vario-MRA Double bubble cut down for fast as fk riding-Tiger screen-Tank protector-Stomp grip panels-Optimate lead   Gone to Heaven  :sorry: 

 

1991 MK1 in need of some TLC watch this space   :) Sorted and on the Road Mick  :P  :P it's the bike that Jack built  ;) Gone to Heaven  :wub: 

 



0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users