21 replies to this topic

[curlylegend]

First time I've ever used my 1991 TDM 850 in rush hour traffic. What I do find is that it's kind of squirmy at walking speed ? Hard to describe but on my old BMW R80GS I could roll in  straight line in first gear with the throttle closed, same as my old Honda FT 500. Is my memory playing tricks and twenty years ago it seemed that I actually could ride a motorcycle competently, but the truth is I was crap then and even worse now ?

 

The other thing that gets me is what's the script with this model ? do you rev the f... out of it when negotiating roundabouts or just lug it in 3rd gear ?

 

I'm finding it hard to cope with roundabouts smoothly, any advice ?

I used to always try to go into corners and bends slow on a trailing throttle and accelerate out. But it's not coming easy with my TDM.

[JBX]

The center of gravity is higher on the TDM, this leads to less stability compared to some poorly designed ugly bikes...

It may take some time to get used to this.

To take roundabouts it's better to keep the engine giving some acceleration and control the speed with the rear brake.

That's what I personally do but there are some other way to go.

Edited by JBX, 20 June 2018 - 08:20 pm.

[curlylegend]

The center of gravity is higher on the TDM, this leads to less stability compared to some poorly designed ugly bikes...

It may take some time to get used to this.

To take roundabouts it's better to keep the engine giving some acceleration and control the speed with the rear brake.

That's what I personally do but there are some other way to go.

 

I've certainly noticed that !  OK, I'll try using the rear brake...….

[thelodger]

I would also suggest having a little more slack in your throttle and consciously  encouraging yourself to open the throttle smoothly.

 

I have found that I have to concentrate all the time to get a smooth ride from my TDM 900. No bad thing I suppose but something of a surprise to me when I bought it. 

[poppykle]

Practice, practice, practice. The TDM is a little top heavy however I was able to do a 35k heavy traffic commute with little worry. Roundabouts and city traffic I use lower gears and keep above 3k. City riding I usually keep it in 2nd and 3rd.

[CrashTestDuffy]

Practice, practice, practice. The TDM is a little top heavy however I was able to do a 35k heavy traffic commute with little worry. Roundabouts and city traffic I use lower gears and keep above 3k. City riding I usually keep it in 2nd and 3rd.

A 35k commute?! That's almost a complete circumference of the earth in kilometres (1.4 times around in miles...)

[poppykle]

A 35k commute?! That's almost a complete circumference of the earth in kilometres (1.4 times around in miles...)

 

OOPS!    35km each way, one of the reasons I have now retired.   

[Bjørge]

The most striking difference between the MkI and the 9er is handling roundabouts; The MkI is more top heavy (maybe that's why it tends to oversteer), has a need for being pulled back up once you get it leaned.

 

That said, letting go off the bars (releasing any tension in arms) in tight corners at low speed makes things easier. 

 

Drivetrain slack (& imprecise clutch, in my case) adds to difficulty level 

[Pedro]

The center of gravity is higher on the TDM, this leads to less stability compared to some poorly designed ugly bikes...

It may take some time to get used to this.

To take roundabouts it's better to keep the engine giving some acceleration and control the speed with the rear brake.

That's what I personally do but there are some other way to go.

Weheyy! some one else that uses the back brake! after hearing other bikers only ever using fronts, i thought i was the only one. I do the same, i scrub off speed using the back brake and i find i dont need to use the front a lot when entering bends or roundabouts. it keeps the bike more stable and less wobbly. maybe its a TDM thing. ride it like a big tall trail bike and you wont be dissapointed. 

[fixitsan]

Weheyy! some one else that uses the back brake! after hearing other bikers only ever using fronts, i thought i was the only one. I do the same, i scrub off speed using the back brake and i find i dont need to use the front a lot when entering bends or roundabouts. it keeps the bike more stable and less wobbly. maybe its a TDM thing. ride it like a big tall trail bike and you wont be dissapointed. 

 

When you use the front brake, unless you're on a BMW with a telelever front end, you shorten the wheelbase as the forks compress, and on taller bikes with a lot of fork travel that can make a difference in the way the bike feels as you tip into a corner under braking

[curlylegend]

Well I had a good day today. Lovely run up from Foix to Saint-Girons and then via back roads to just outside Bordeaux.

So "I got my mojo back"....whatever that means !  My grandson say that's what you say nowadays in situations like this....

Anyway, rather than using the back brake to scrub off speed, I've been trying to be more sensitive with the throttle and also using 3rd and even 2nd gear more. If I carefully roll back the throttle I can control the speed of entry to a roundabout or bend without dipping the front forks by using the front brakes.  And then the trick is to open the throttle smoothly enough to accelerate away cleanly.

Like you say, practice, practice. practice.....

 

I would also suggest having a little more slack in your throttle and consciously  encouraging yourself to open the throttle smoothly.

 

I have found that I have to concentrate all the time to get a smooth ride from my TDM 900. No bad thing I suppose but something of a surprise to me when I bought it. 

 

 

Practice, practice, practice. The TDM is a little top heavy however I was able to do a 35k heavy traffic commute with little worry. Roundabouts and city traffic I use lower gears and keep above 3k. City riding I usually keep it in 2nd and 3rd.

 

 

The most striking difference between the MkI and the 9er is handling roundabouts; The MkI is more top heavy (maybe that's why it tends to oversteer), has a need for being pulled back up once you get it leaned.

 

That said, letting go off the bars (releasing any tension in arms) in tight corners at low speed makes things easier. 

 

Drivetrain slack (& imprecise clutch, in my case) adds to difficulty level 

I've recently replaced the rubber cush drive in the rear hub and that's made a BIG difference.  I'm running the chain with an extra 10 mm free play from standard,  I might put it back to 50mm free play and see how that works out.

Yesterday I took a road from Perpignan to Puigcerda through the eastern Pyrenees and my confidence took a severe knock. Some of the bloody bends were more like sections in the Scottish Six Day Trial ! And especially when Maw, Paw, and the weans in a base model Renault Clio blast past you at warp speed.....

However, all was made up today, I found roads that exactly suited my current level of motorcycling skill.

The fun's back in motorcycling, so much so that if I was a drinking man I would murder a shandy !

[fixitsan]

Well I had a good day today. Lovely run up from Foix to Saint-Girons and then via back roads to just outside Bordeaux.

So "I got my mojo back"....whatever that means !  My grandson say that's what you say nowadays in situations like this....

Anyway, rather than using the back brake to scrub off speed, I've been trying to be more sensitive with the throttle and also using 3rd and even 2nd gear more. If I carefully roll back the throttle I can control the speed of entry to a roundabout or bend without dipping the front forks by using the front brakes.  And then the trick is to open the throttle smoothly enough to accelerate away cleanly.

Like you say, practice, practice. practice.....

 

 

 

 

 

I've recently replaced the rubber cush drive in the rear hub and that's made a BIG difference.  I'm running the chain with an extra 10 mm free play from standard,  I might put it back to 50mm free play and see how that works out.

Yesterday I took a road from Perpignan to Puigcerda through the eastern Pyrenees and my confidence took a severe knock. Some of the bloody bends were more like sections in the Scottish Six Day Trial ! And especially when Maw, Paw, and the weans in a base model Renault Clio blast past you at warp speed.....

However, all was made up today, I found roads that exactly suited my current level of motorcycling skill.

The fun's back in motorcycling, so much so that if I was a drinking man I would murder a shandy !

 

 

And if you were a drinking man i doubt you would just have a shandy !

 

The TDM has a lot of engine braking, to the point that, as you've found out, you can use it as the third brake and if you plan ahead make really good use of that 'feature'

[curlylegend]

 

 

And if you were a drinking man i doubt you would just have a shandy !

 

The TDM has a lot of engine braking, to the point that, as you've found out, you can use it as the third brake and if you plan ahead make really good use of that 'feature'

 

Yes, that's exactly what I'm finding.

 

With  full tank especially, I notice the top heaviness and I think that might have something to do with the poor tracking at walking speed. Has anyone changed handlebars specifically to help this ?  Or is this model ultra sensitive to tyre makes. I've found that running my Michelin Pilots 2 at the higher end of the recommended pressures makes a big positive difference to the general feel of the bike. At lower pressures it definitely tramlines !

[dandywarhol]

Sounds like the rear tyre has flatted in the centre - possibly by running too low a pressure for too long.

 

Not good to "lug" these engines - they are quite oversquare, resulting in them being fond of some revs - also, if you lug the engine then you'll wear out the carb emulsion tubes. As the carbs are fully downdraught then the slides operate horizontally and if the engine is run like a "traditional twin" the needles batter up and down in the tubes and the tube holes become oval, leading to erratic low speed running and excessive fuel consumption. 

 

It's not all bad though - they can be a relaxing bike to ride when you come accustomed to it 

[harvey krumpet]

The TDM does not mind slow chicanery at all but does require confident inputs. Rear brake is a must for slow speed control, keep the revs steady and use the back brake to temper the speed and start the turn in, release and the bike will stand up again. 

 

Admittedly I was in a line of traffic recently at sub walking pace and had to saw the bars a little to stay feet up, it's not a trials bike!

 

Hopefully a wee vid of me when I started practising "slow speed handling techniques" below. Car parks are great places to improve skills and develop balance.

 

https://youtu.be/3LWz_BVUPTk

[JBX]

Check idle rpm too : mountain riding & short curves are harder with a low idle rpm, too much stop & go behavior.

I raised mine at around 1300-1400.

[Bjørge]

Check idle rpm too : mountain riding & short curves are harder with a low idle rpm, too much stop & go behavior.

I raised mine at around 1300-1400.

 

Well, he has an MkI. To my experience no need for this, they pull strongly from idle with no probs.

[curlylegend]

Sounds like the rear tyre has flatted in the centre - possibly by running too low a pressure for too long.

 

Not good to "lug" these engines - they are quite oversquare, resulting in them being fond of some revs - also, if you lug the engine then you'll wear out the carb emulsion tubes. As the carbs are fully downdraught then the slides operate horizontally and if the engine is run like a "traditional twin" the needles batter up and down in the tubes and the tube holes become oval, leading to erratic low speed running and excessive fuel consumption. 

 

It's not all bad though - they can be a relaxing bike to ride when you come accustomed to it 

 

I'll keep a close eye on the tyres, they're pretty new, and I seem to have found the optimum pressures. They're sensitive but not worryingly so. At low speed you get that slightly wriggly feedback from poor road surfaces, but I actually quite like that.... the bike feels alive !

That's a really good explanation why this bike should be revved more like a two stroke than a four stroke thumper.

I did another 450 km from Bordeaux to home today and put in plenty of practice, practice, practice.....and it's paying off. On twisty bits and roundabouts I'm keeping the revs up and being very delicate with the throttle.  It's really satisfying being able to hold it at steady speed with the throttle and wind it up on the exit.  It would be even more satisfying if I could guarantee a nice quiet engagement of third gear from second.  Half the time it just slips in like...….fill this bit in for yourselves !......other times it's clunk click !  Reminds me a lot of the gearboxes on older 7 series BMW bikes, they were bulletproof but could be really clunky too.  They were very temperature sensitive and the factory recommendation was to heavily preload the main bearings and run very light oil. Once set up they felt almost Japanese ….??

  But I'm getting there, and it's more than relaxing to ride, it's really enjoyable, it's got SOUL !

[curlylegend]

The TDM does not mind slow chicanery at all but does require confident inputs. Rear brake is a must for slow speed control, keep the revs steady and use the back brake to temper the speed and start the turn in, release and the bike will stand up again. 

 

Admittedly I was in a line of traffic recently at sub walking pace and had to saw the bars a little to stay feet up, it's not a trials bike!

 

Hopefully a wee vid of me when I started practising "slow speed handling techniques" below. Car parks are great places to improve skills and develop balance.

 

https://youtu.be/3LWz_BVUPTk

 

That's what I do, I go to the local supermarket carpark on a Sunday afternoon to practice just like that.  I did hint to the staff that I was thinking about getting part of the front carriageway concreted over but the groundkeepers are muttering about going on strike.....damned conservatives !

Check idle rpm too : mountain riding & short curves are harder with a low idle rpm, too much stop & go behavior.

I raised mine at around 1300-1400.

 

That's a very good point, I'll do that tomorrow.  It will hardly affect the fuel consumption will it ?

[TKH]

Assume the wheels are straight?