18 replies to this topic

[jiff]

......as a result of a recent droppage ( no personal damage ) I had to remove the nose-fairing on my 4TX.
.....which involved disconnecting (snipping) the indicator wires.Attempting to re-install, can't get the indicators to flash. Indeed, at the moment, both front indicators don't illuminate.
I'll spare you, for the moment at least, added complicating details, but my initial question is :

Is there a 'flasher unit' as such & if so, where is it located & is there a way to check if it is up-the-pictures?

now for the complicating detais:
1) the indicators are non-OE.......but worked fine before the spill.....but I seem to recall fitting a relay, even though they're conventional bulbs, not LEDs
2) there is an indicator buzzer fitted (which now sounds when the o/s indicator is attempted, but constant sound, not 'pips'....therefore related to lack of flashing? Doesn't sound at all when n/s indication is attempted.
3) apart from the 'indicator' fuse in the fuse box, might there be another fuse which relates to that relay

There's probabliy more complicating stuff, but I'll leave it at that, for the moment.....hoping a step-by-step
approach will avoid confusion.......for me and for you....

........Jiff

[aircooled68]

Flasher unit under tank at rear just in front of starter relay

Edited by aircooled68, 23 February 2014 - 02:41 pm.

[Gdogg]

What else did you remove from inside the fairings ? coz if you only "snipped" the wiring to get the panels off then surely if you just reverse the process they should be working prior to the snips being used. Was anything else "snipped" ?

 

Are the 2 wires to each indicator conneced the same as befor ?

 

Have you checked to see if the bulbs have blown ?

[jiff]

.......Is the 'flasher unit' the same as the 'turn signal relay?......
.....couldn't locate flasher unit.....lifted rear of tank & looked for what I presumed to be an 'electrical boxy thing'......small matchbox size?......black-ish?.......all I could see under the back of the tank was a bunch of assorted wires & connectors running next to the across-the-frame brace onto which the rear of the tank bolts......into a black 'rubber glove' type shroud,
HBOL shows a pic of the starter relay (HBOL 9:18, pic.25.2a) being (on the N/S?) next to the 'Hard / Soft ' rear suspension adjustment........but doesn't actually say it's a pic. of a TDM, let alone a 4TX.......and next to it appears to be the same unit shown in HBOL 9:8, pic 11.3a described as 'turn signal relay'........

.........retired hurt for this evening......Jiff.

[jiff]

What else did you remove from inside the fairings ? coz if you only "snipped" the wiring to get the panels off then surely if you just reverse the process they should be working prior to the snips being used. Was anything else "snipped" ?
 
Are the 2 wires to each indicator conneced the same as befor ?
 
Have you checked to see if the bulbs have blown ?

.........my assumption precisely!.......nothing else 'snipped'......and all bulbs seem OK.......
The inclusion of 'the buzzer' seems to add complication .......at least in my addled brain......BUT......(& I did issue a warning re: complications) ......
whilst checking the bulbs , I managed, unknowingly, to bend one of the terminals in the O/S indicator, which then shorted when the ignition was switched, blowing the relevant fuse in the fusebox (several times before I 'unearthed' THAT problem)......before that episode, the O/S indicator & the buzzer at least, were both 'flashing'.......now not so.....& I'm wondering if that shorting might have blown the flasher unit......?........hence where I am / was .......till I retired hurt......for today,

.......I said I needed help from a genius....'cos I sure ain't one today .....me.......Jiff.

[leehenty]

you may have blown the flasher unit  subsitute a known good one see if it's this. All bulbs must be working or it won't flash if it's the thermal type flasher.

[jiff]

[quote name="leehenty" post="291158" timestamp="1393184687"................ All bulbs must be working or it won't flash if it's the thermal type flasher.[/quote]

.........how would I know / tell if it's a 'thermal type flasher' ?.........or, alternatively, what type of flasher is fitted to a 4TX?

..........Jiff

[jiff]

........and, having scrutinised Wemoto, they list a 'flasher relay' but not a flasher unit......I'm still unsure whether they are one and the same thing.....?

.......Jiff

[leehenty]

more or less the same thing.

 

refer to page 305 of the service manual, left positive wire is brown, right is dark green. The other, usually black, wires are earth.

 

manual can be found here http://www.carpe-tdm...p?showtopic=193

 

post #8

Edited by leehenty, 23 February 2014 - 10:45 pm.

[RolfieB]

Why did you have to snip the wires? Just being nosey like.

[jiff]

Why did you have to snip the wires? Just being nosey like.

......can't quite remember, actually, but , since the winkers are non-standard, and looking at how the wiring is now, I can only presume
that when I fitted them, for some reason, I didn't / was able to use normal connectors, so tack soldered and self-amalgamating taped them.......dunno why....

.....Jiff

[jiff]

........those of you who may need to get a life might recall my recent electrical mini-dramas with indicators that wouldn't flash........
That problem appeared to have been solved when I discovered an imperfect bullet connection down the line, and replaced the blown flasher unit.
Now what happens is, with the bike at standstill, engine not running....... check operation of indicators (including audible warning , incorporated yonks ago)........perfect!...even when all connections woggled.
Ride off, full of confidence & self-righteousness, and notice that buzzer sound is intermittent....as is flasher on dash......as are flashers themselves.
Thinks......imperfect earthing?......imperfect other connections?......bad language.
Woggle all connections, woggle all seeming appropriate wires,.......no apparent effect.
Depression at the thought of having to dismantle inner-fairing again, & chop off all that self-amalgamating
to check all connections.
Is there any relevant circumstance that might occur with bike in motion / engine running which doesn't apply with bike stationary, engine off? (presumably sidestand switch is not concerned with indicators)
......Jiff

[dapleb]

Merged with other thread so Carpedians can see the full picture so far.

[Studley Ramrod]

Loose bulb perhaps ?  Could be rattling with the bike on the move.

[TYREDNGRUMPEE]

I knows!!!

 

These buzzer/indicator thingies are wired up so that the buzzer is sometimes connected directly to earth when the brake switches front or rear are applied.

Buzzer is then silenced.

Sounds (or it doesn't ) that the earthing of your brake+buzzer circuit has been dunnded wrong. Even if your setup isn't wired this way try removing the buzzer temporarily and see what happens.

 

BTW

Check first that you aren't one of those annoying people that rides around with a badly set up rear brake light switch that flashes as you ride along.

-merrily earthing your indicators as you ride along 

Edited by TYREDNGRUMPEE, 22 March 2014 - 05:23 pm.

[jiff]

......just to wrap it up........ future reference for those who pursue similar contorted path to my own...

(History: 9-12 months ago, fitted buzzer...no problem. 3-4 months ago, fitted 4 new aftermarket indicators ....no problems - 2 of my originals had been damaged, so I replaced all 4 with some I felt looked better. It also appears I fitted new flasher unit , don't remember why, as supplier of indicators later insisted it wasn't required. 6 weeks ago bike fell over, nose fairing damaged, front indicators disconnected - by snipping......
- all ressambled.......problems started.....existing flasher unit/ relay blown, replaced with Wemoto. All flashers, & buzzer, worked at standstill, but intermittantly when on the move.)

The problem was solved, after much laborious agonising, consultation with experts, and bunging quids at those who did a conscientious job , but didn't rectify the intermittant operation........

1) buzzer removed from circuit, and all connections in flasher circuits soldered, front and rear, 'earths' checked, bulbs checked.
still intermittent operation when on the move.
2)expert 1 opines, try different flasher relay. Had been using Wemoto appropriate unit. Replaced with (OE?) Denso unit.......works
fine, but flashes at illegaly fast rate. Assume Wemoto unit faulty, they supply replacement.......repeat of intermittent function on the
move.
3)expert 2. strokes chin, inspects writing on selection of my flasher units that I brought along. He suggests something to do with mismatch between flasher unit and wattage of bulbs in my aftermarket indicators. He tests vintage flasher unit (Lucas? from E type?) works fine. Suggests that, on the move, when revving, voltage increases, thus wattage output also.....somehow causing intermittant action?
4) lying in bed, next morning, I decide to see if HBOL details spec. of OE flasher unit. No luck...BUT....it does say OE flasher bulbs are 21watt. My aftermarket indicator bulbs are 10 watt. Could try stronger bulbs but don't want to melt plastic or burn out fine wires. Locate
suitable flasher unit at Mac Motors in Tooting.......adapt wiring......instal......ALL SERENE!

Boring as that might have been, it would have been even more so if I hadn't edited it down to the 'highlights'....there was so much more
in between!
..........,,,,Jiff.

[dapleb]

 Well done jiff.  Lecky probs are orrible and intermittent lecky probs the pits!!! 

[wicklamulla]

Freedom For Tooting !

[TYREDNGRUMPEE]

I'll file that one away for later.