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New Clutch - Too Thick?


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#1 Bjørge

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Posted 26 May 2020 - 04:13 pm

I changed the clutch yesterday, and I must say it seemed like the new plate stack was thicker than the old one. Well, assembled dverything and when testing today the clutch doesn't seem to free up properly 😐

I bought from Wemoto, EBC friction plates and Gekko steel plates. Also fit shorter springs to make it comfortable, but I assume this will affect grabbing effect - not keeping the clutch from freeing up 100%.

Oky, I won't get my money back, so considered removing 1 pair of plates and fitting the old, longer springs.

Any ideas, anyone?
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#2 drewpy

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Posted 26 May 2020 - 04:15 pm

did you soak the plates in oil overnight?


"As I Lay Rubber down to street, I pray for traction I can keep. But if I skid and begin to slide, please dear god protect my ride"

Mods; Oil pressure switch, neoprene rear inner mudguard, scottoiler, highway pegs,  fenda extenda, 1999 carbs and airbox, Kais suspension setup, later clutch springs, LED lamps, Metmachex swingarm, Hagon Shock, Oxford heated grips, 4 way fused accessory Bus, 17" 3CV front wheel, Michellin R6 tyres, GPS speedo, 5' ignition advance.


#3 dablik

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Posted 26 May 2020 - 05:01 pm

Hm interesting, i've fitted a complete new set from Wemoto, both plates Gecko but i had to leave the original smooth steel friction plate (1st plate) as was not in the kit, have you put the smooth plate, ie no dimples in ! mine clutch seems to be working okay although the bike is static.


Bigred mk1 R1 Calipers- Braided lines- Givi wing rack-Crash bungs- Hi vis bullets-PR2's- and a hoot to ride.

Quad 900 Silver Laser duo tech pipes-Scott oiler-Engine crash bars- Radiator mounted see me ring LED's-Datatool system 3 alarm -Centre stand- Extender fender-Renthal bars-Handle bar risers-Mirror extenders-BMW GS Handgaurds-Acumen uprated horn & Nautilus-Stainless steel Radiator guard-Givi wing rack-OEM screen-Yammy touring screen-MRA Vario-MRA Double bubble cut down for fast as fk riding-Tiger screen-Tank protector-Stomp grip panels-Optimate lead   Gone to Heaven  :sorry: 

 

1991 MK1 in need of some TLC watch this space   :) Sorted and on the Road Mick  :P  :P it's the bike that Jack built  ;) Gone to Heaven  :wub: 

 


#4 Bjørge

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Posted 26 May 2020 - 05:34 pm

Hm interesting, i've fitted a complete new set from Wemoto, both plates Gecko but i had to leave the original smooth steel friction plate (1st plate) as was not in the kit, have you put the smooth plate, ie no dimples in ! mine clutch seems to be working okay although the bike is static.


Same experience, had to keep the inner plate as it wasn't in the kit.

did you soak the plates in oil overnight?

Nearer to fortnight than over night😀

Edited by Bjørge, 26 May 2020 - 05:33 pm.

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#5 dandywarhol

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 12:47 pm

Not sure what you mean by "Comfortable". Shorter springs will increase the lever effort (like shortening road springs on yer Vauxhall Corsa will give your passenger nipple rash because the ride will be firmer :pimp: ) .They might also become coilbound and not let the plates separate properly.


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#6 drewpy

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 12:52 pm

Not sure what you mean by "Comfortable". Shorter springs will increase the lever effort (like shortening road springs on yer Vauxhall Corsa will give your passenger nipple rash because the ride will be firmer :pimp: ) .They might also become coilbound and not let the plates separate properly.

they will be tdm900 springs so should be fine.

you don't need to pull as far to release the clutch. I think that was meant by comfortable.

I have them on mine and I prefer the shorter clutch pull.


"As I Lay Rubber down to street, I pray for traction I can keep. But if I skid and begin to slide, please dear god protect my ride"

Mods; Oil pressure switch, neoprene rear inner mudguard, scottoiler, highway pegs,  fenda extenda, 1999 carbs and airbox, Kais suspension setup, later clutch springs, LED lamps, Metmachex swingarm, Hagon Shock, Oxford heated grips, 4 way fused accessory Bus, 17" 3CV front wheel, Michellin R6 tyres, GPS speedo, 5' ignition advance.


#7 dandywarhol

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 06:49 pm

they will be tdm900 springs so should be fine.

you don't need to pull as far to release the clutch. I think that was meant by comfortable.

I have them on mine and I prefer the shorter clutch pull.

 

Ok thanks for that. Are the 900 springs a lighter gauge wire? What do you need to do to allow for the shorter spring and to allow the plates to separat? 


1967 Yamaha TD1C 250, 2014 Kawasaki W800, 2011 Aprilia Tuono 1000 V4, 2020 Yamaha XSR900

"At the cutting edge of technophobia" Scotland_180-animated-flag-gifs.gif mccoy.gif
 


#8 Bjørge

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 07:47 pm

The springs press plates together (=engaged clutch), so shorter or weaker springs could possibly cause slip and not less freeing up. When you pull the lever, you overcome spring pressure. I wanted a longer action from free to fully engaged, as I always found the MkI clutch to be an operation challenging left hand precision...

Edited by Bjørge, 27 May 2020 - 07:49 pm.

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#9 drewpy

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 08:35 pm

 

Ok thanks for that. Are the 900 springs a lighter gauge wire? What do you need to do to allow for the shorter spring and to allow the plates to separat? 

no they are stonger but you don't need to pull them as much
no issues whatsoever with slippage or separation. I assume the clutch hasn't changed between models.

I think I got the info from this site

 

found it
http://www.carpe-tdm...clutch +springs


Edited by drewpy, 27 May 2020 - 08:39 pm.

"As I Lay Rubber down to street, I pray for traction I can keep. But if I skid and begin to slide, please dear god protect my ride"

Mods; Oil pressure switch, neoprene rear inner mudguard, scottoiler, highway pegs,  fenda extenda, 1999 carbs and airbox, Kais suspension setup, later clutch springs, LED lamps, Metmachex swingarm, Hagon Shock, Oxford heated grips, 4 way fused accessory Bus, 17" 3CV front wheel, Michellin R6 tyres, GPS speedo, 5' ignition advance.


#10 wicklamulla

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 10:42 pm

they will be tdm900 springs so should be fine.

you don't need to pull as far to release the clutch. I think that was meant by comfortable.

I have them on mine and I prefer the shorter clutch pull.

 

 

you sure they are TDM 900 springs and not 1999 onwards TDM 850 springs?


spyball alarm/immob, bluespot brake calipers and Stainless hoses, Fournales air adjustable shock with Remote Resevoir, forks raised 10mm thru yokes, racetech linear fork springs in 15 wt oil, Kappa wingrack/luggage, heated grips, Kedo handguards, dual heat controller to power heated jacket liner and or pants!!, Stebel 136DB horn, K&N air filter, colour matched Baglux tank cover (magnetic tank bag modified to fit cover), osram +50% headloight bulbs, headlight protector,"NitramSpecial" parking loight, tail light indicators all running on LED's & incorporate "Lite Buddies", MK7 Scottoiler fitted, taller screen, 2-2 stainless steel CCC's, Devil stainless down pipes. MKI Renntec engine crash bars & sump guard.
engine changed july 2007 on a dyno run it made 79.1BHP / Torque 59.9Had a brief flirtation with a 1999 MKIIa but it blew an exaust valve on the M5 so was sold on to be repaired.

I loike tay and hang sangwiches !

www.kenhogantreeservices.co.uk

http://s33.photobuck...77/wickla/?sc=6



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#11 dandywarhol

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 10:20 am

The springs press plates together (=engaged clutch), so shorter or weaker springs could possibly cause slip and not less freeing up. When you pull the lever, you overcome spring pressure. I wanted a longer action from free to fully engaged, as I always found the MkI clutch to be an operation challenging left hand precision...

 

Are you sure the shorter spring's coils aren't touching together when you pull the lever and the plates aren't separating fully because the travel is shorter? 


1967 Yamaha TD1C 250, 2014 Kawasaki W800, 2011 Aprilia Tuono 1000 V4, 2020 Yamaha XSR900

"At the cutting edge of technophobia" Scotland_180-animated-flag-gifs.gif mccoy.gif
 


#12 drewpy

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 10:47 am

 

 

you sure they are TDM 900 springs and not 1999 onwards TDM 850 springs?

no not sure now.  was a while ago


"As I Lay Rubber down to street, I pray for traction I can keep. But if I skid and begin to slide, please dear god protect my ride"

Mods; Oil pressure switch, neoprene rear inner mudguard, scottoiler, highway pegs,  fenda extenda, 1999 carbs and airbox, Kais suspension setup, later clutch springs, LED lamps, Metmachex swingarm, Hagon Shock, Oxford heated grips, 4 way fused accessory Bus, 17" 3CV front wheel, Michellin R6 tyres, GPS speedo, 5' ignition advance.


#13 Bjørge

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 01:47 pm

 
Are you sure the shorter spring's coils aren't touching together when you pull the lever and the plates aren't separating fully because the travel is shorter? 

Yes, because they were roughly same wire diameter.
The problem is that after ~half travel it starts freeing but doesn't fully disengage upon fully squeezed. Very little happens, which I believe is consistent woth the idea the whole stack fills too much hence no room for free turning.

I will have to disassemble, but don't know yet what to do - put in old plates or try remove 2 of the new ones.

Btw:
Is placing the bike on side stand sufficient for removing clutch cover w/o draining oil?

Edited by Bjørge, 28 May 2020 - 01:48 pm.

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#14 Nog

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 04:01 pm

Is placing the bike on side stand sufficient for removing clutch cover w/o draining oil?

 

Yep have done it myself without issue.  You might lose a tiny amount as you take the cover off, so put a container under to catch it.

 

If you really want to make sure, put a couple of thin planks of wood under the tyres, so it will lift it a touch more and the angle will be more than usual and really get all the oil over to the left side of the bike.



#15 Bjørge

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 04:27 pm

Thanks! What I need to know 😎
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#16 dablik

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 07:02 pm

 

 

you sure they are TDM 900 springs and not 1999 onwards TDM 850 springs?

oem number given in the other link in the other thread, when linked search is furra 99..


Bigred mk1 R1 Calipers- Braided lines- Givi wing rack-Crash bungs- Hi vis bullets-PR2's- and a hoot to ride.

Quad 900 Silver Laser duo tech pipes-Scott oiler-Engine crash bars- Radiator mounted see me ring LED's-Datatool system 3 alarm -Centre stand- Extender fender-Renthal bars-Handle bar risers-Mirror extenders-BMW GS Handgaurds-Acumen uprated horn & Nautilus-Stainless steel Radiator guard-Givi wing rack-OEM screen-Yammy touring screen-MRA Vario-MRA Double bubble cut down for fast as fk riding-Tiger screen-Tank protector-Stomp grip panels-Optimate lead   Gone to Heaven  :sorry: 

 

1991 MK1 in need of some TLC watch this space   :) Sorted and on the Road Mick  :P  :P it's the bike that Jack built  ;) Gone to Heaven  :wub: 

 


#17 wicklamulla

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 10:15 pm

no not sure now.  was a while ago

 

 

oem number given in the other link in the other thread, when linked search is furra 99..

 

 

Just as i thought.  The 1999-2002 TDM 850 dimpled clutch plates are the ones you can retrofit to earlier TDM's.


spyball alarm/immob, bluespot brake calipers and Stainless hoses, Fournales air adjustable shock with Remote Resevoir, forks raised 10mm thru yokes, racetech linear fork springs in 15 wt oil, Kappa wingrack/luggage, heated grips, Kedo handguards, dual heat controller to power heated jacket liner and or pants!!, Stebel 136DB horn, K&N air filter, colour matched Baglux tank cover (magnetic tank bag modified to fit cover), osram +50% headloight bulbs, headlight protector,"NitramSpecial" parking loight, tail light indicators all running on LED's & incorporate "Lite Buddies", MK7 Scottoiler fitted, taller screen, 2-2 stainless steel CCC's, Devil stainless down pipes. MKI Renntec engine crash bars & sump guard.
engine changed july 2007 on a dyno run it made 79.1BHP / Torque 59.9Had a brief flirtation with a 1999 MKIIa but it blew an exaust valve on the M5 so was sold on to be repaired.

I loike tay and hang sangwiches !

www.kenhogantreeservices.co.uk

http://s33.photobuck...77/wickla/?sc=6



http://reg.imageshack.us/v_images.php

post-1-1150550733.gifpost-1-1150550726.gifpost-1-1150559830.gif


#18 Bjørge

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Posted 30 May 2020 - 11:55 am

Solved!

I overlooked the fact that there were 7 regular steel plates and a special one at the bottom of the stack.

The kit that I bought contained 8 regular steel plates and I threw them all in.

Stupid me 😐

But- most importantly; the clutch feels fantastic! Much longer action, not the on/off feel from last 70,000kms

Just need an oem clutch cable, the one I got is really crap from new - you really feel each cord as they grind tveir way

Now- to polishing 😎

Yes, because they were roughly same wire diameter.

Well, they're shorter but a tad bit thicker wire. So I put in the originals. The clutch tured out good, so I'm happy

Edited by Bjørge, 30 May 2020 - 11:55 am.

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#19 drewpy

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Posted 30 May 2020 - 03:31 pm

good to hear


"As I Lay Rubber down to street, I pray for traction I can keep. But if I skid and begin to slide, please dear god protect my ride"

Mods; Oil pressure switch, neoprene rear inner mudguard, scottoiler, highway pegs,  fenda extenda, 1999 carbs and airbox, Kais suspension setup, later clutch springs, LED lamps, Metmachex swingarm, Hagon Shock, Oxford heated grips, 4 way fused accessory Bus, 17" 3CV front wheel, Michellin R6 tyres, GPS speedo, 5' ignition advance.



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