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Rear Brake Not Working.

Rear brake

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#1 Fcoy

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Posted 12 February 2020 - 10:47 pm

Hello,

2008 ABS 9er.  Rear brake was binding so I pulled the caliper off and found it needed new pads which I duly fitted having given the piston a clean up in situ.  Then made a major error in bleeding the brake without topping up the resevoir under the seat.  Worked for ages trying to get a brake and eventually got the brake to lock with a lot of pressure on the rear brake lever.  Now the weird begins.  The brake would now not release unless the bleed screw was opened.  This happened a couple of times.  Then I get a really good rear brake pedal pressure but no back brake.  Suspect something has gone awry with the ABS.

Any thoughts?

 



#2 Catteeclan

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Posted 13 February 2020 - 06:49 am

Hi. Doesn't sound like the pads were the fault.

If its still locked after releasing the bleed nipple it can only be a calliper or sticking pad fault.
Worn out pads won't cause the brake to lock up other than a pad being worn out enough to slip between carrier and disc. (Yes I've seen this).
Caliper pistons should be able to be pushed back easily, often just thumbs is enough.

If the pads fit into the carrier easily then you still have a calliper fault.


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#3 Snowbird

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Posted 13 February 2020 - 07:57 am

If you ran the reservoir dry I would suggest a spec of crud in the return hole in the master cylinder, if the pistons or pads were sticking opening the bleed screw would not help.

I've had it happen before on an old Z650 and a MC clean out was the cure.

Have to admit I know nowt about abs.


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#4 TKH

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Posted 13 February 2020 - 01:15 pm

Air in the system?


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#5 chrisr

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Posted 13 February 2020 - 03:45 pm

Have you tried it with the engine running? Maybe the abs system needs to sort itself out after the bleeding? (Not that I know anything about abs either!)

Edited by chrisr, 13 February 2020 - 03:46 pm.

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#6 steve27bha

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Posted 13 February 2020 - 04:23 pm

Maybe the ABS has got screwed from lack of fluid.

 

I refer you to the 900A Workshop Manual Supplement 2005 which has details of the ABS and its maintenance.

 

Some of the content from p65 on is copied below.

 

• When bleeding the ABS, make sure there is always enough brake fluid before applying the
brake. Ignoring this precaution could allow air to enter the ABS, considerably lengthening
the bleeding procedure.
• If bleeding is difficult, it may be necessary to let the brake fluid settle for a few hours.
• Repeat the bleeding procedure when the tiny bubbles in the hose have disappeared.

.......

• Final check
Checking procedures
1. Check the brake fluid level in the brake master cylinder reservoirs.
2. Check the wheel sensors for proper installation.

....

Hydraulic unit operation test
The reaction-force pulsating action generated in the brake lever and brake pedal when the
ABS is activated can be tested when the motorcycle is stopped.
The hydraulic unit operation can be tested by the following two methods.
•Hydraulic unit operation test 1:

this test generates the same reaction-force pulsating action that is generated in the brake lever
and brake pedal when the ABS is activated.
•Hydraulic unit operation test 2:

this test checks the function of the ABS after the system was disassembled, adjusted, or serviced

3. Perform hydraulic unit operation test 1 or 2.
4. Delete the malfunction codes.
5. Perform a trial run.

 

Full details in the manual, downloadable from JBX's site:- https://www.tdm-yamaha.heliohost.org/?page=DOC  You need to sign up/in.


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#7 Fcoy

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 09:01 am

Thanks to everybody who replied.  Rear caliper and pistons are not seized so I'm pretty sure its an ABS issue.  Didn't fancy shorting out the ABS circuit with a home made jumper but I found a supplier in France who had the oem cable in stock. https://www.gn-moto....m-1300-fjr.html

Total cost £24.55 including postage which was more than the cost of the part.  FJR owners club also have a version of this which would probably do the job.  I will give an update when I get to use it.



#8 velf2003

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Posted 15 February 2020 - 04:25 pm

Translated from Dutch to Englisch, so maybe not fully technical correct English. But, if you have read it, you know what to do with an ABS TDM900.

 

remove the right-hand side cover. -plug what you need is in a holder on the inside of the tub carrier, behind the abs computer. - remove the plug from the plug - connect the 2 plugs one side of the securing clip of the plug with a short cable with 2 narrow flat cable lugs. -switch on the brake lever or brake pedal, -set the ignition key on -contact - after about a second the ABS unit starts pumping for 4-5 seconds. (at least if it does) you should also use this procedure to change your brake fluid. -first change brake fluid in the normal way, so that there is also new brake fluid in the pipes around the abs pump. -to perform the above procedure with the nipples on the caliper open. - make sure the abs unit is pumped 5-6 times (so switch the ignition on and off for a new cycle each time) - then refill the brake cup again and suck in the brake fluid again to remove the old fluid from the abs pump from the pipes. this is what you do for both the front brakes and the rear brake. they are 2 completely separate systems


Or in German, with pictures:

https://wiki.tdm-for.../Zusatz_mit_ABS



#9 PICARD

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Posted 15 February 2020 - 05:55 pm

Yeah, German is definitely clearer!!
Sorry sarcasm is not called for. Thanks for taking the time to post...seriously..
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#10 Snowbird

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Posted 15 February 2020 - 06:25 pm

If the brake is locking I can't help thinking that that is the last thing abs should do (it's sort of in the description), I still think I could be on the money with the crud in the mc return hole, it's normally only a tiny hole and the running fluid dry tends to lend itself to the theory.


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#11 dablik

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Posted 15 February 2020 - 11:25 pm

If the brake is locking I can't help thinking that that is the last thing abs should do (it's sort of in the description), I still think I could be on the money with the crud in the mc return hole, it's normally only a tiny hole and the running fluid dry tends to lend itself to the theory.

Would'nt take much either, just a tiny splodge of shoite would do it..


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#12 Snowbird

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Posted 16 February 2020 - 01:13 am

Would'nt take much either, just a tiny splodge of shoite would do it..

Tell me about it, there's not much more embarrasing than sitting at the side of the road having to undo a bleed screw to get the rear brake to let go when the fluid hits the disc and bursts into flame, desperately trying to blow it out when someone says says "take your full face lid off, it'll work better", ooops!  :huh: 


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#13 Catteeclan

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Posted 16 February 2020 - 09:50 pm

If the brake is locking I can't help thinking that that is the last thing abs should do (it's sort of in the description), I still think I could be on the money with the crud in the mc return hole, it's normally only a tiny hole and the running fluid dry tends to lend itself to the theory.

 

Do you agree releasing/removing the bleed nipple should remove any hydraulic pressure allowing the wheel to spin freely.
Still think the faults on the wheel end.


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#14 Fcoy

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 12:18 pm

No blockage at the resevoir, Checked by loosening the bango nut at the rear brake master cylinder and allowing some fluid to run out.  However, tried to perform the ABS test and found it diidn't work properly.  ABS unit just vibrated for about 5 or 10 seconds without pulsing the brakes.  Does anyone have the fault codes list for the ABS system?



#15 TKH

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 01:19 pm

Hi - a link to JBX  https://www.tdm-yama...ex.php?page=CS1. He usually has all the manuals, but when I just went on they weren't available. Ping me your email and I'll try to send you my copy of the manual.


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#16 steve27bha

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 01:42 pm

Fcoy,
I gave a link to the ABS shop manual above in post #6.
I would expect the codes to be in that, or failing that elsewhere on JBX's site.
He has manuals for the basic bike too; these are needed for the rest of the bike.

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#17 Fcoy

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Posted 01 March 2020 - 03:13 pm

I have all the manuals, thanks.  ABS error codes list is nowhere to be found in the manuals, or online.  Probably going to have to get a replacement abs unit.  R1 seems to use the same part number (2B0-85930-09) but I need to confirm that.



#18 TKH

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Posted 02 March 2020 - 12:41 pm

ABS codes should be in the manuals? Does this help at all?

 

4. The ABS warning light "1 " flashes and a malfunction code "2" is indicated on the multi-function display when the test coupler adapter "3" is connected to the ABS test coupler "4" for troubleshooting the ABS.

The ABS test coupler can be accessed by removing the left inner panel (front cowling). When the test coupler adapter is connected to the ABS test coupler, the ABS warning light starts flashing and the multi-function display indicates all the malfunction codes recorded in the ABS ECU.

Test coupler adapter

90890-03149

NOTE:

The ABS warning light comes on or flashes if the vehicle is ridden with the test coupler adapter connected to the ABS test coupler.

• Disgnosis indication

The place where the ABS diagnosis code is displayed is also used for the indication of the Fl diagnosis code, odometer, trip meter and fuel trip.

As the priority level of indication, the diagnosis code for Fl is the first and the diagnosis code for ABS is the second.

Accordingly, the ABS diagnosis code is not displayed during the diagnosis for Fl.

NOTE:

It shall not be in the diagnosis mode for Fl.


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#19 steve27bha

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Posted 02 March 2020 - 10:41 pm

I have all the manuals, thanks.  ABS error codes list is nowhere to be found in the manuals, or online. .....

My Supplementary Service Manual, 2005 has two pages of Malfunction Codes on pages 109 & 110, as part of the Troubleshooting section starting on p103.


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#20 TKH

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Posted 06 March 2020 - 06:55 pm

The ABS supplement has all the ABS error codes in it - 2B0_2005_serv.PDF from JBX. This section has the ABS error codes, a full breakdown of the ABS system and a troubleshooting section to help sort out problems.

 

If you plug in your abs tester and switch on, the ABS error code should be displayed on the screen or you can use a multimeter to get the codes via the pulses. It also explains how to clear the codes once your done.

 

If you're having problems getting hold of the ABS supplement, ping me your email and I'll send you a copy.


Edited by TKH, 06 March 2020 - 06:56 pm.

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