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I Don't Get It, Admin Charge For Buying Bike!


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#1 Zorst

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 03:35 pm

Yes I know this isn't new and you all know about it.

 

But I'm just venting my anger.

 

I haven't had a bike for ages. There's not many bikes for sale privately these days so that narrows down my search.

 

I've seen many bikes that I'm interested in but they're with dealers. The thing is I won't even go near dealer or entertain them because the advert will state anything from fifty to one hundred and fifty pounds admin charge. Errr what for?

 

If I go buying an appliance, my weekly shop clothing etc I don't get charged an admin fee and if I visit any dealers i'll tell 'em this.

 

If the unfortunate visit to a dealers may arise, I will and do warn them that there's an admin charge to sell me a bike.

 

That's fifty pounds for swiping my bank card for the deposit and another fifty pounds for swiping my bank card again to take the final payment. And they look at me with a smirk on their face, then realise I'm serious.

They laugh and say 'really'. To which I reply 'well I'm only doing what you're doing'

 

I know a lot of car dealers are doing it and they say it's to cover the warranty and the service before they vehicle goes out.

 

But I just want to see ONE price!

 

 

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#2 chrisr

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 03:55 pm

It’s a scam, pure and simple, why should you pay them to do their job? Don’t agree the sale until they remove this charge.

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#3 Zorst

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 04:07 pm

I work for an electrical automation suppliers and I'm told it costs £30 to £50 to put a customer's order on the system.This cost is incurred by someone having to put the order on the system and to cover the cost of the lighted heated room as well as other electricity for computers etc.

 

And we don't charge for that. It's built in with the cost of the day.

 

 

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#4 dapleb

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 04:26 pm

Lolzio never have or will buy a boike from a shop.
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#5 TKH

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 03:00 am

Sometimes (so I've heard) a dealer will do this is selling a bike for someone. I had a dealer near me try that once. Needless to say I didn't buy.



#6 dablik

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 09:25 am

Sometimes (so I've heard) a dealer will do this is selling a bike for someone. I had a dealer near me try that once. Needless to say I didn't buy.

 

Then needless to say any admin charge should be levelled at the owner selling through the bike shop, were ripped off left right and centre in this wonderful country.


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#7 fixitsan

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 09:39 am

A dealer, is just a franchisee, just like a branch of McDonalds or any other franchise. They are sold a bike at a price by the manufacturer, at rates negotiated due to the size of the franchise, errrrr....I mean dealer.

 

The franchises are being squeezed more by the factories, who reduce the discounts to the franchise if sales targets aren't being met. But in hard times where your average sales numbers fall you still have basic overheads to cover, even when you don't sell anything.

 

You would think that they would just hide the cost in the price of the bike, but then there will be competition among dealers when some of the busiest ones decide to do away with the admin fee, on a sale by sale basis in order to make sure the customer doesn't go elsewhere.


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#8 Studley Ramrod

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 09:52 am

Franchises make a bundle getting you on a payment plan, selling parts & equipment, as well as selling you labour costs at £40-£50 per hour so the actual cost of a new bike would prolly be negligible in the grand scheme of things.

 

Sometimes, it's not the actual cost, it's the feeling of being ripped off that leaves a bitter taste.


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#9 Rallyist

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 12:02 pm

Example CMC charge a £99 documentation fee, they would never get my money.


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#10 fixitsan

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 12:53 pm

Franchises make a bundle getting you on a payment plan, selling parts & equipment, as well as selling you labour costs at £40-£50 per hour so the actual cost of a new bike would prolly be negligible in the grand scheme of things.

 

Sometimes, it's not the actual cost, it's the feeling of being ripped off that leaves a bitter taste.

 

I wouldn't deny it seems expensive. but for the UK at least it remains very much a seasonal business.

 

let's say there's 5 full mechanics at £15 per hour, 4 apprentices and grease monkeys at £10 per hour, an admin clerk or two..... and you probably find that your workshop costs over £140 per hour in labour costs, plus you need to pay everyone's national insurance, and then some insurance and liability policy contribution...paid holidays and so on, it all adds up

 

What happens in winter when the workshops are quieter, do they just lay people off / I suppose some do. I know an Edinburgh dealer who opened his whole shop, barber, workshop, sales floor and cafe one day and saw 2 customers that day through the door recently. It's not a good business model, it is not only seasonal but it's also affected by the weather. on average you can expect good years and bad years to balance things out but you need cash in the bank to keep you going through the hard times.

 

I won't defend their expense, but as someone who has looked at buying a business like that and realising that you have to compete or stay backstreet, i can see that you can't really expect anything but top prices. Unless the manufacturers open the shops themselves we will always see this sort of market split.

 

I wouldn't buy a secondhand bike from a dealer and being lucky that I've got the skills I doubt I'll use a motorcycle workshop. But if i wanted a brand new bike what options do you have but go to a dealership ? Can you import it yourself directly from a manufacturer ? I've no experience with that.

 

What you do get from a dealer, especially if you're a totally green newbie, is the ability to walk in when there's something wrong and demand instant response, free gifts, discounts for their cockups etc. If I screw up fitting new fork seals this week I have to absorb the cost.....and some people just don't have a garage in the first place.


Edited by fixitsan, 30 March 2018 - 12:57 pm.

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#11 PICARD

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 04:14 pm

Talking to a salesman in Kawasaki dealership recently, said his margin on a new bike was £250, leaving very little room to haggle. If that's true, most of his income is going to be from servicing, accessory sales etc. Surprised me.
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#12 fixitsan

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 07:23 pm

Talking to a salesman in Kawasaki dealership recently, said his margin on a new bike was £250, leaving very little room to haggle. If that's true, most of his income is going to be from servicing, accessory sales etc. Surprised me.

 

 

I wouldn't be surprised if that's true.  A similar situation exists in the camera business....once RRP's have been set camera dealers are trying hard to sell accessories and books.

 

Restaurants try to price their meals so that the ingredients cost is below 1/3 of the final price, just because running restaurants is so expensive, and the more upmarket ones would definitely go out of business if they didn't have such a large markup on drinks.

 

Every budget is squeezed hard in a recession isn't it


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#13 Zorst

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 08:12 pm

Example CMC charge a £99 documentation fee, they would never get my money.

 

At the time i wasn't even thinking of the main dealers. It was more of the single outlet bike shops.

 

Superbike factory at Macclesfield £99. So Many bike at Oldham, Highbarn at Oldham. On the second hand stock at Bill Smiths at Chester.


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#14 Robodene

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 09:47 pm

The way to avoid charges is to take your business elsewhere (if that is possible). Or negotiate it away. Otherwise it amounts to a price increase which the manufacturer is afraid to charge. In difficult times it can be the buyer who is in the strongest position. I do have some sympathy for dealers though because I have often wondered how they make any money at all (manufacturers too, come to that). But some do, it seems. But £250 for the sale of a Kawasaki looks like petty cash to me. Maybe the sales are too thinly spread among too many dealers. Perhaps dealers have spotted the tricks that insurance companies get up to. Which reminds me of the dealer who wanted to charge for test rides - "returned if you buy, of course"; it was quietly dropped quite quickly.
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#15 Studley Ramrod

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 08:45 am

Talking to a salesman in Kawasaki dealership recently, said his margin on a new bike was £250, leaving very little room to haggle. If that's true, most of his income is going to be from servicing, accessory sales etc. Surprised me.

 

That'll be his cut for selling it, the company he works for will also take a slice of the sale price.  No company I know of works on a 3% profit margin.


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#16 trevini

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 05:55 am

Although it was a long time ago now, when I was working in the motor trade the dealer margin was an average of 7% on new vehicles. Not so bad if you're selling a 100k Bentley, but obviously less so if you're selling a 6K TDM (as they were at the time). Of that 7%, PDI and prep would need to be taken out along with any over allowance on any trade in (or negotiated discount) and either a fixed fee or about 10% for the sales guy. It won't leave a lot for the dealer as net profit. I still think the "admin" charge is a bit cheeky though and just a way to try to skim (or is that scam?) a bit more profit from the customer. Personally, I'd negotiate it away or walk. There are plenty of dealers who need the sales and are willing to do a deal. Used bikes are a different ball game though, as each has to be taken on it's own merit, plus the dealer will probably have more profit in it to start with. 


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#17 Riggers

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 09:39 am

Same thing applies if you change anything on your bike and tell the insurance company. Usually they want £50 'admin charge'. Total rip off.

 

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#18 fixitsan

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 10:38 am

Same thing applies if you change anything on your bike and tell the insurance company. Usually they want £50 'admin charge'. Total rip off.

 

Riggers.

 

 

Yup, Bennetts charge 'only' £32 for any change.

 

Although in saying that, because I have a 4 bike policy with them, if I want to add another bike to my garage and as long as it is in an insurance group at or below that of the TDM900, it costs me just £32 to add it and for it to be insured with the same benefits


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#19 Riggers

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 10:54 am

 

 

Yup, Bennetts charge 'only' £32 for any change.

 

Although in saying that, because I have a 4 bike policy with them, if I want to add another bike to my garage and as long as it is in an insurance group at or below that of the TDM900, it costs me just £32 to add it and for it to be insured with the same benefits

 

When I put my new cans on my bike I wrote to Bikesure (Adrian Just) and told them about the change in the old fashioned way using paper, pen envelope and stamp. They e.mailed me back saying they couldn't deal with this by letter and would I phone them on their premium number! presumably so they could get my credit card details and charge me the 'admin fee'.

 

I took the view that I'd fulfilled my legal obligation by telling them by letter and they'd acknowledged receipt of it by emailing me.

 

So I took no further action, and I'll do the same again if ever I make any further changes!

 

Riggers



#20 fixitsan

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 11:50 am

 

When I put my new cans on my bike I wrote to Bikesure (Adrian Just) and told them about the change in the old fashioned way using paper, pen envelope and stamp. They e.mailed me back saying they couldn't deal with this by letter and would I phone them on their premium number! presumably so they could get my credit card details and charge me the 'admin fee'.

 

I took the view that I'd fulfilled my legal obligation by telling them by letter and they'd acknowledged receipt of it by emailing me.

 

So I took no further action, and I'll do the same again if ever I make any further changes!

 

Riggers

 

 

I think that's only fair, I will give it a go next time ! :)


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