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Rear Shock Nightmare


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#1 Jingo

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 07:43 PM

Hi everyone,

Some of you might remember a few weeks ago I mentioned my TDM wasn't riding funny, wasn't sure if there was an issue with it. Well, it turns out there was....

I took it to a garage to see if they had any ideas, it was quite late in the day so the guy only had time to ride it round the block and pronounce without more time with it he couldn't identify the problem. Now this problems been annoying me for months, enough to write off what was always a dubious TDM (I've had problems since day one - although partially because day 4-5 I crashed it quite beatifuly when grabbing too much front brake in the wet), so I thought I'd head up the road and check out some new bikes at lovely M&S in Newcastle.

Now, I've known these lot are dodgy dealers, so expected them to offer me pittance for the bike. Anyway, long story short, when they did their "checks" to see its trade in price, they identified the cracked front fairing, missing grabrail at the back and a couple of other things, and offered me 1000. For perspective, bought at 2200, has 13k miles on it and is a V reg 4TX one.

This was until, his mechanic mate called us upstairs, and showed me the rear shock, which it turns out wasn't actually connected to the back of the bike at all, and lifted quite clearly off! Hard to explain btu I'm sure you know what i mean, basically if you lift the seat upwards, rather than lifting the bike, the rear shock isn't attached to the long metal bits which lead to the wheels from the front of the bike (sorry I'm not nearly technical enough to know the parts and I'm furiosuly writing this), so you just kind of pull the seat up freely instead.

Now, the guy at this point pretty much thought this was a total knock off, and offered me 500 trade in, or 600 parts and labour to repair the back bit.Now M&S are well known around these parts for being total rip offs, so I took the bike home with me where its now sitting in the garage.

If anyones managed to make it through all that, I have a few questions, the first being how much would you realistically expect to replace a rear shock for? Including parts and labour, i'd like to get better with bike repairs etc. but its far too major a project to start with. Now, to be perfectly honest I'm pretty certain this isn't the cause of my original niggle with the bike that caused me to take it into the garage in the first place, which a few people reliably told me on here was likely the coils (fortunatly M&S don't know about that one), how much would it cost to fix both the coils (presumabyl replace), and this rear shock?

In addition, if I was going to turf the bike off, is it really only worth 500? I'll take some photos of it if people are interested, its got about a 2 inch scrape on the top fairing, a few niggling bits and pieces missing and the rear grab handle is missing, it does have a Givi rack mounted though which surely is worth a few hundred bob in itself including box. If its worth more, does anyone know how much I should expect to ask for?

Finally, (i realise this shouldn't go in this part of the forum but hey), avoid J L motorbikes of Darlington at all costs. I had problems from day one with him getting it MOT'd, and apparently other things are missing from the bike that i've never seen (something under the seat? sorry for being vague, I was barraged with a list of problems and didn't make a copy), in addition half the work i've had done (new exhaust, rear brake disc) were inherited from him despite apparently the bike being in top condition!

Grrr!!

Thanks for reading this anyway, sorry for sounding so demanding for responses, I'm just rather annoyed ranting.gif


#2 allan

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 07:53 PM

to me if the bike starts and stops fine,all electrics are fine i'de spend some money on a new shock and fit it myself or try and find a good second hand one but these are hard to find as most tdm's get used so rack up the miles .

#3 Jingo

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 07:58 PM

Yeah, I've never attempted any sort of bike maintenance past changing oil, so I don't really have the tools or expertise to do this kind of job myself. Some people would say this is a perfect on the job learning experience but I don't think I want to start today!

#4 dapleb

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:01 PM

Can you take a pic of what is broken? Shock, frame or swingarm?
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#5 aircooled68

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:01 PM

Its not really a bad job..... only a few basic tools needed


come on there must be a local member willing to help....... bit far from me



Dave
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#6 Guest_Pantboy_*

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:07 PM

i think it was k2col who had his shock break at the lower pivot

assuming you can get the old bits off and it's the shock that has broken and not the swingarm or frame, changing the shock is a fairly simple job


#7 MattW

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:12 PM

Also, changing the coils is an easy job as well and, they are about 25 each from wemoto (i think).

#8 Guest_Pantboy_*

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:15 PM

had a look around, it was k2col

http://www.carpe-tdm...o...ic=7241&hl=

does it look anything like this?

#9 Jingo

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:26 PM

Heres a photo, now that I'm thinking a bit more rationally, you can see the shock is lifting out of the cradle bit at the bottom, I can upload the picture bigger if people can't see it. EDIT: And yes Pantboy, exactly like that! I'd just gone to get the camera when you posted happy.gif

Edited by Jingo, 09 March 2009 - 08:26 PM.


#10 dapleb

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:35 PM

AHh ok so broken shock (the lesser of the evils). It can be a total geeet to get the lower bolt out of the sleeve if it has seized...and it probably has...other than that its a straight forward job.
"Whats up", "Piston Broke", "Yeah me too...hic"

If you want to mark your location on the Carpe map: http://www.carpe-tdm...opic.php?t=5117

Doin valve clearances? Use dappers valve shim exchange program and the job will be carroty - Free (other than you postin me yer shims) for sporting members.

Active member of TPLQHCSRSFC and TSRMCMAS (even though a year off) and avid fan of PM not sent.

#11 HonaTDM

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:49 PM

QUOTE(Jingo @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 06:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yeah, I've never attempted any sort of bike maintenance past changing oil, so I don't really have the tools or expertise to do this kind of job myself. Some people would say this is a perfect on the job learning experience but I don't think I want to start today!


If you have a centrestand it is an absolute doddle, if not it isn't.
Basically you undo the bolts holding the shock to the bike (one at each end), insert the new shock and tighten up the bolts.
Taking the back wheel out first helps. Allow a couple of hours, three coffees and a smoke or two.
Hagon shocks are good replacements for a couple of hundred quid. Beware of second hand stuff because it's liable to be shagged - why else is it for sale?
I'm in Durham if you need someone to laugh at you rotflmmfao.gif

#12 Jingo

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 08:59 PM

QUOTE(HonaTDM @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 07:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If you have a centrestand it is an absolute doddle, if not it isn't.
Basically you undo the bolts holding the shock to the bike (one at each end), insert the new shock and tighten up the bolts.
Taking the back wheel out first helps. Allow a couple of hours, three coffees and a smoke or two.
Hagon shocks are good replacements for a couple of hundred quid. Beware of second hand stuff because it's liable to be shagged - why else is it for sale?
I'm in Durham if you need someone to laugh at you rotflmmfao.gif


I don't have a centre stand I'm afraid, but I've got a paddock stand? Do you think that'd make it easy enough? I'll start hunting around for shock replacements, any good places to start?

#13 MattW

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:05 PM

these guys

http://www.bike-revi...o.uk/page1.html

have quoted me 255 delivered. I think though there are some issues with the srping length on the standard hagon jacking the back end up. It may not be an issue for you though. i am sure someone will be along in a minute who knows what they are talking about!!

#14 ChrisG

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:26 PM

The reason it's broken is most likely to be because the bottom bush and bolt have siezed together. If this is the case you'll struggle to replace just the shock. k2col had to replace the swingarm as well, and I had the same problem on a bike we broke for parts and had to cut the bracket off the swing arm to salvage the shock and then send it off to get a new bush fitted.
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#15 apw99

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:28 PM

QUOTE(MattW @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 08:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
these guys

http://www.bike-revi...o.uk/page1.html

have quoted me 255 delivered. I think though there are some issues with the srping length on the standard hagon jacking the back end up. It may not be an issue for you though. i am sure someone will be along in a minute who knows what they are talking about!!

Matt - I just did my back shock so I have a few hints.
First I don't understand the age of the bike as I am in Ireland and we have a different reg system but i assume it's an 850?
The paddock stand will not work - you need a centre-stand or else use the paddock stand to raise it and then use jack to hold under the engine, then remove the paddock stand. make sure the bike is stable!!
The bottom bolt will be stiff or seized so lots of WD40 for a few days to soak in if it is seized.
The standard Hagon is longer and lifts the back of the bike up by about 1" so if you are struggling with height now it might be too big. Hagon do a custom version for an extra 50 squids. The hagon transforms the bike so it's worth the money if you are keeping it.
The standard settings on the Hagon work fine for me but i have only put a few hundred miles up so that is open for review.

Thats all you need apart from a torque spanner if you can get one.

Good luck and sorry to hear about the trouble you have had to date - apw


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#16 dapleb

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:30 PM

QUOTE(ChrisG @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 08:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
you'll struggle to replace just the shock.


blink.gif If its seized to the bush just cut down each side with sawzall or similar and it'll plop oout. Why did you need to cut the bracket?

"Whats up", "Piston Broke", "Yeah me too...hic"

If you want to mark your location on the Carpe map: http://www.carpe-tdm...opic.php?t=5117

Doin valve clearances? Use dappers valve shim exchange program and the job will be carroty - Free (other than you postin me yer shims) for sporting members.

Active member of TPLQHCSRSFC and TSRMCMAS (even though a year off) and avid fan of PM not sent.

#17 TonyDevil

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:32 PM

QUOTE(dapleb @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 08:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
blink.gif If its seized to the bush just cut down each side with sawzall or similar and it'll plop oout. Why did you need to cut the bracket?

because there isnt enough space to get a cutter of any kind between the swingarm mount and the bottom shock bolt pivot bit
"Never argue with an idiot. They just bring you down to their level and beat you with experience"
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Black 1991 850 MK1, 160k+ miles(ish, best guess really, gave up trying to keep count after 3rd set of clocks and 3rd engine), PilotRoad2 tyres, custom stubby exhaust system, bluespot calipers & goodridge braided hoses with dunlopads, maxton forks, Ohlins shock, kedo handguards, stainless TDM grill, Scottoiler with lubetube & dual nozzle thingy, Givi Wingrack2 with E45 & 2xE36s, renntec crash bars, Autocom with blueteeth & PMR radio, TomTom Rider2, Optimate IIIsp, Bagster tank cover, anti-dazzle coating
to fit : led spotlights, heated grips, new braided lines and rear caliper that actually has bleed nipples
Silver-ish 2003 900, 70k miles, PilotRoad3 front tyre (new@65k) & PR2 rear(new at 69k), Renthal 755 bars with KTM handguards, oxford unheated grips, power commander 3usb, scorpion titanium exhausts, standard screen with vario winglet thingy, stainless grill, oem centre stand, bagster tank cover, givi monokey topplate mounted on grabrail with V46 topbox, Givi PL pannier rails with E21s, crash bungs, mirror extender thingys, Halfords Advanced Laser Blue brillance bulbs, 21w led spotlights, touring scottoiler with leehenty dual nozzle, Autocom with blueteeth & PMR radio, TomTom Rider3 Urban, winter style anti-dazzle coating
to fit : led brake light strip, replacement heated grips

current rides : TDM850 3vd/mk1=tourer&scratcher, TRX850=weekend twisty toy, TDM900=commuter, Z750 hardtail=project
gone but not forgotton : XTZ750=overland touring toy, GS500e, GS125

If you don't like my answers you should cease asking stupid questions!

#18 dapleb

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:33 PM

You need to make some space.
"Whats up", "Piston Broke", "Yeah me too...hic"

If you want to mark your location on the Carpe map: http://www.carpe-tdm...opic.php?t=5117

Doin valve clearances? Use dappers valve shim exchange program and the job will be carroty - Free (other than you postin me yer shims) for sporting members.

Active member of TPLQHCSRSFC and TSRMCMAS (even though a year off) and avid fan of PM not sent.

#19 TonyDevil

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:35 PM

QUOTE(dapleb @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 08:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You need to make some space.

the only way to make space is to mangle the swingarm mount
"Never argue with an idiot. They just bring you down to their level and beat you with experience"
My TDM :
Black 1991 850 MK1, 160k+ miles(ish, best guess really, gave up trying to keep count after 3rd set of clocks and 3rd engine), PilotRoad2 tyres, custom stubby exhaust system, bluespot calipers & goodridge braided hoses with dunlopads, maxton forks, Ohlins shock, kedo handguards, stainless TDM grill, Scottoiler with lubetube & dual nozzle thingy, Givi Wingrack2 with E45 & 2xE36s, renntec crash bars, Autocom with blueteeth & PMR radio, TomTom Rider2, Optimate IIIsp, Bagster tank cover, anti-dazzle coating
to fit : led spotlights, heated grips, new braided lines and rear caliper that actually has bleed nipples
Silver-ish 2003 900, 70k miles, PilotRoad3 front tyre (new@65k) & PR2 rear(new at 69k), Renthal 755 bars with KTM handguards, oxford unheated grips, power commander 3usb, scorpion titanium exhausts, standard screen with vario winglet thingy, stainless grill, oem centre stand, bagster tank cover, givi monokey topplate mounted on grabrail with V46 topbox, Givi PL pannier rails with E21s, crash bungs, mirror extender thingys, Halfords Advanced Laser Blue brillance bulbs, 21w led spotlights, touring scottoiler with leehenty dual nozzle, Autocom with blueteeth & PMR radio, TomTom Rider3 Urban, winter style anti-dazzle coating
to fit : led brake light strip, replacement heated grips

current rides : TDM850 3vd/mk1=tourer&scratcher, TRX850=weekend twisty toy, TDM900=commuter, Z750 hardtail=project
gone but not forgotton : XTZ750=overland touring toy, GS500e, GS125

If you don't like my answers you should cease asking stupid questions!

#20 Jingo

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:38 PM

QUOTE(apw99 @ Mon 9th Mar 2009, 08:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The standard Hagon is longer and lifts the back of the bike up by about 1" so if you are struggling with height now it might be too big.


Funny you should mention that, I'm a pretty lofty 6 ft 7 so its possibly one of the better upgrades I could make smile.gif. Does this affect the sidestand massively? I don't have a centrestand, and don't really want to incur the expense of getting one if I can avoid it, looks like I'll be splashing out a bit already.


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